drums in the mix

[EVOL!]

Is it me, or is everyone over mixes where the drums are so upfront? Especially snare and cymbals to the point that they overwhelm the rhythm guitar track. Maybe I am weird because I like my mixes pretty flat, including placing the vocals back.

[Telliot]

I think it's so subjective and genre-based, making it hard to follow a hard fast rule. My personal taste for the music I record is to have the vocals up front, and the drums a little further back, almost as if you were creating the audio version of what you normally see visually onstage. That said, I think it's good to experiment and consider each song on a case by case basis.

[RuffiansFC]

i like that i am starting to hear more songs allowing for a more natural sounding drum mix. it's nice to be able to hear a kick drum without feeling it in my chest.

[InLimbo]

I love the drums up front, but that's just my personal taste and what I feel works best in the music I write. Sidechains are awesome and you can't make a decent sounding one with a flatly mixed project.

But, there are occasions where the drums pushed further back is acceptable. This song by Stargazer Lilies comes to mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqL19g0HVRo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[NBarnes21]

I always make sure kick and snare are up front, but it bugs me when cymbals are mixed too loudz. Lots of that comes down to how the drummer plays though. More important than volume to me is that they feel present, and that you can get a sense of the space they're being played in. That goes with all instruments really though

[milkybar]

I'm a big fan of quiet vocals and loud drums, but I think that it's a psychological thing from hearing bands live. I like 'relatable' recordings, and in practices/gigs, its usually quiet vocals, and super loud drums! This pretty much does solely go for little indie bands though...

[RuffiansFC]

i like big sounding drums. They sound loud without having to be. If a kick or snare is too dry and up front, it becomes too distracting. dry drums have their moments where they work well, but not in a "real life" setting.

[milkybar]

i like big sounding drums. They sound loud without having to be. If a kick or snare is too dry and up front, it becomes too distracting. dry drums have their moments where they work well, but not in a "real life" setting.

True, although I find too many people reach for reverb to make drums big. I'm a massive Steve Albini fan, so perhaps I'm a bit biased, but room mics on a kit really bring things to life (obviously dependant on how nice the room is). I'd take a stereo room pair over a mono overhead!

[Nick W]

I'm a big Albini fan too and I like how his mic sensibilities (capturing the sound of the kit in the room) is an extension of what the best jazz recordings from the 60s achieved (thinking Blue Note/Van Gelder and Impulse/Thiele).

[milkybar]

It's not totally dissimilar to the mindset when recording orchestral music either, which is an interesting way to take it. Get a good sounding source, in a good sounding space, and just capture that sound. Then whatever nice gear there is just adds flavour to the sound. If only I had access to nice sounding rooms...

[zombiecookie]

My philosophy is that every instrument must be audible. The drums do not have to be totally upfront, but cymbals just get easily lost in the mix of they are not loud enough... So does the bass drum.

Also, the cymbals are where the treble is at, so making them loud makes the recording sound more professional and hi-fi, I suppose. I always thought that Nevermind sounded better than Bleach, amog other reasons because the drums are very present

[EVOL!]

My philosophy is that every instrument must be audible. The drums do not have to be totally upfront, but cymbals just get easily lost in the mix of they are not loud enough... So does the bass drum.

Also, the cymbals are where the treble is at, so making them loud makes the recording sound more professional and hi-fi, I suppose. I always thought that Nevermind sounded better than Bleach, amog other reasons because the drums are very present

I disagree. Cymbals eat guitars in a mix. I would rather have cymbals bleed into other mics than dedicating mics to them, especially if the drummer is loose and sloppy with his hats ala Alex Van Halen or Lars Ulrich.

[FrankRay]

I think that acoustic instruments such as drums define how loud the song sounds; if the drums sound quiet the brain assumes the band is very loud (like the mary chain for instance) whilst loud drums imply a taut controlled band who play relatively quietly (like fugazi, say). The velvets, for instance, achieve volume in part by having very little in the way of top end on the drums bringing the guitars upfront. Heroin was meant to have been so quiet that Mo Tucker stopped playing because she couldn't hear anyone else, but it sounds really loud because the drums are muffled.
Obviously the acoustic instrument is usually the voice, so if the singer whispers the song sounds quieter; if they scream it sounds louder. When I used to produce other people the volume in the headphones of the voice compared to the backing track would determine the performance I achieved.

[zombiecookie]

My philosophy is that every instrument must be audible. The drums do not have to be totally upfront, but cymbals just get easily lost in the mix of they are not loud enough... So does the bass drum.

Also, the cymbals are where the treble is at, so making them loud makes the recording sound more professional and hi-fi, I suppose. I always thought that Nevermind sounded better than Bleach, amog other reasons because the drums are very present

I disagree. Cymbals eat guitars in a mix. I would rather have cymbals bleed into other mics than dedicating mics to them, especially if the drummer is loose and sloppy with his hats ala Alex Van Halen or Lars Ulrich.

Well yes, really loud cymbals can certainly take up the guitar's space. Recordings where the cymbals are too loud sound as unnatural to me as the ones where they are to quiet… I just hate it when you have to put effort into even hearing the cymbals. Sometimes the crash is so quiet it makes one wonder why they even used it in the first place.

But then again, I guess it also boils down to personal taste, maybe

EDIT: I have no experience with recording drums, just mixing tracks from drum machines. But if you just let the cymbals bleed into the other mics, isn't that kind of limiting in terms of panning them?
for examle, I have just been discussing with a friend of mine how some people would use one mic to record both snare and hi-hat and how I would rather use seperate mics. Because I would rathe rput the snare pretty much in the center of the mix and pan the hi-hat to the left or right

[jorri]

There's a nack to controlling the transients with compression that gets them loud, but only for a short period of time so they don't overwhelm.
But it also seems counterproductive to make them attacky then add lots of reverb, i think sustain/decay can just be lengthened sometimes to blend better with guitars.

It varies but i agree that when they are hidden in the mix the bands sound louder, if the drums are too upfront it just sounds like you have your head next to an annoying drummer, with guitar amps struggling to keep up. I really dislike clean tight drums basically, just don't find it adds any sense of space at all.