Novak Pickup Selection and a noisey 78 JM

[scottme]

Hi all,

Does anyone have sample sound files to compare the various JM Curtis Novak pickups? Now that I will soon have a nice 66 JM, I'm thinking about "improving" my 78 JM with a Novak or two. Curtis's page will be really cool when there's sample of each pickup on there to make selecting the right one easier. 

As mentioned in the topic heading, my 78 JM seems to be rather noisey. It has copper foil and everything seems to be connected and original, but it's considerably noisier than my 68 Jag (and higher output). The strings / bridge is earthed to the sheilding. The level of electrical noise changes with guitar orientation (away from CRTs etc). I will post some pics of the guts soon. Any ideas what it might be and any remedy? Maybe it's just the way it's meant to be?

[scottme]

Ok for starters these don't look right to me:

Tone:


Vol


I guess it means that the tone is 250k and the vol 500k. Aren't these late 70s ones supposed to have 1M in each?

[fullerplast]

No, definitely not right. I assume that it should have 1 meg pots... but am not 100% certain.

Regardless, those pots are just plain wrong. They look like import pots. Fender was using CTS or Stackpole pots in the 70s. Those are neither. I don't even see the customary codes that all US pots have. The wiring looks pretty gnarly too.

Since they're not original anyway, I recommend replacing them with Fender AVRI/CTS 1 meg pots and a full rewire to the original schematic. There's no reason it should be noisy.

[glimmertwin]

I had a 65 Jag that was pretty noisy.  You really got to watch the solder joints on the brass plates.  If its not super solid, there will be annoying buzz.  You may try toying with the open guitar while plugged in to find one particular joint that is more problamatic than the others.  I wouldn't think the pots would be the source of your troubles unless they are defective and leaking something to ground-but it probably wouldn't work at all if that was the case. 

[fullerplast]

Whats with that big honkin' black ground wire to the 500K pot?

This has def been tampered with. A good rewire and new pots should cure you. Not that the pots are causing the noise, but the whole package with a probable improper installation.

[scottme]

Thanks guys.

Here's another shot of both:

[CurtisNovak]

Hi all,

Does anyone have sample sound files to compare the various JM Curtis Novak pickups? Now that I will soon have a nice 66 JM, I'm thinking about "improving" my 78 JM with a Novak or two. Curtis's page will be really cool when there's sample of each pickup on there to make selecting the right one easier. 

As mentioned in the topic heading, my 78 JM seems to be rather noisey. It has copper foil and everything seems to be connected and original, but it's considerably noisier than my 68 Jag (and higher output). The strings / bridge is earthed to the sheilding. The level of electrical noise changes with guitar orientation (away from CRTs etc). I will post some pics of the guts soon. Any ideas what it might be and any remedy? Maybe it's just the way it's meant to be?

Scott I hope you dont mind me replying to this directly.  It might seem stupid on my part to not just submit to the the sound clip thing and just post them.  I just have a just have a personal issues w/ it to me is like buying a car after only test driving it over the net.  The thing is there are way too many variables that determine tone of a pickup, from the body, neck, strings, amp, recording equipment,  your computer speakers, and lastly and most importantly it the fingers and playing style of the player.  I have gone in to a music store and played 6 identical new guitars and they all are a little different.  I agree it is a nice "feel good" thing that likely helps sales and I should just submit to it, but I still hold out on principal.  What I can direct you to however is a website where someone recorded a whole bunch of Jazzmaster pickups.  What I can deal w/ this site is it was done in one sitting, w/ the same guitar, same amp settings, same player, playing the same riff.  This wont tell you how it will sound for you, but it will give you a cross comparison of all the pickups. 
The site is http://jazzmasterjam.com/
He does not have the MP3's linked yet but you can hear the sound files here http://jazzmasterjam.com/mp3/

as for you noise the wiring does not look stock and there appears to be a mix match of parts, you might want to clean it up using new pots and such.

[scottme]

Thanks for replying Curtis, it's a great help (and honour as always!). I was more curious how each of the JM PUs sound compared to each other in a constant setting, as the jazzmasterjam guy has done, and similar to the SD pages. I realise it's a little tricky to organise.

What is the spec on the wire used, i.e. guage / sheilding?

Thanks for the wiring photos. If you have any more hires detail photos of the wiring, I'd love to accept them at scottme100@hotmail.com if it's no bother    It will be a whil before I lay my grubby hands on my 66 JM, which is very similar to yours, which I see you do have some nice pics (great detail BTW). Sad though...

Here's a few pics of the extra foil added to the cavities:





Should I pull the foil and just earth to the orig shield?

On another point, the neck is rather worn out:



The frets have been low for some time, and the rosewood fingerboard is now scooped between the inlay frets. When I retret (hopefully soon) should I get them to try to level the board and put oversize frets on?

Apologies for all the pics and thanks for the advice!

[mezcalhead]

Yeah, I'd just rewire it properly using a decent schematic and cloth wire, etc. There's no extra benefit to putting more shielding foil on top of the shielding plates so you might as well take it off.

That site Curtis linked is a nice one, done by a guy who used to hang around the FDP.

As for the board, it's your decision I guess ..  large frets would mean longer before you have to get it refretted again.

[Jay]

The frets have been low for some time, and the rosewood fingerboard is now scooped between the inlay frets. When I retret (hopefully soon) should I get them to try to level the board and put oversize frets on?

Do you prefer larger frets?  I would tend to say stick true to the original size but it's really waht you prefer the feel of.  I know for me I can't stand jumbo frets.  I don't mind up to medium, like the Dunlop 6105 (I think that's the right number) but if its bigger it feels like one of those silly scalloped boards.  As for sanding the board, a competant tech will do that but you're probably not going to sand out all the pitting.  If you did that the board would get really thin rather quickly.

[scottme]

I turfed out the crappy 250k tone and put in a temp double stack 1M CTS pot until I get the proper ones. I wonder what difference changing the volume from 500k to 1M will do? Still noisey, so next goes the copper shielding - maybe it's acting like a capacitor?

I just noticed that the old diagram says to ground the 3rd tone lug to the pot chassis, whereas the reissue says leave it alone.

Shouldn't your rhythm white wire go to the rhythm switch, not the 3-way?

The AVRI Jag that I am selling has got Jumbo frets. Takes some getting used to, but it does protect the board I guess. The furrows on mine are rather significant.