Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by computarded » Sun Jul 12, 2009 11:19 am

crazypaws wrote: if you just spend some time setting up your american trem, it will lock in place just fine and wont slip, it takes time, hence the beauity of the floating trem. also, be aware, the mexican trems arm isnt as long as the american, it doesnt swoop as smooth, so its hard to use and bend. there are a few pros and cons to both, but stay with the american, play with it, trust me, you will love it much more
I played the mexican version this weekend, and although I thought the guitar looked and played nice, the trem was really weird.  Too short, and instead of being smooth it was sloppy with a faster transition of bend.  I'm sure they can be set up a lot better than the one I played, but just off the wall, an AV seems much better.

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by FPicker » Mon Jul 13, 2009 4:32 am

Meanwhile, the other day I bought some "PTFE Thread Seal Tape", wrapped it around a few winds on the arm, and it is holding the arm in place fine,for now at least, no problems. Took no time or trouble at all. So I guess I'll just keep with this for a while.

I think when I first tried taping it the tape wasn't the right type; sticky and too thick. That's what made me think it didn't work, or was too much trouble. The tape I just got is much thinner, not sticky, and is working just fine for now. so maybe it's not a big problem after all.

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by fretbuzzard » Mon Jul 13, 2009 11:47 am

PTFE tape works for me.  Nonetheless, and while I love my thinskin, I do prefer the strat-style thread in trem arm or, even better, the G&L style with the set screw.

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by FPicker » Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:40 pm

Meanwhile, as this has been going on, other information has come in to me.

I now have it that :

-The powers that be state that the player shouldn’t notice a difference between the screw in and snap-in versions, functionally; so for example a system with one arm attachment method shouldn't work any smoother, sytematically, than one with  the other method.

-The reason Fender switched to a screw-in arm was to alleviate the maintenance needed on the old-school style American Vintage bridges to keep the trem arm snug and so it never popped out.

Which means, all things being equal, the screw-in ought to be preferred I suppose.

The collars of the AV & Classic Player tremelo units are designed pretty differently, as I have now been informed.  The A.V. has the part at the bottom that you can squeeze together to hold the arm more snugly,as has been suggested.  By contrast, the The Classic Player’s is more of a compression fit .
Last edited by FPicker on Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by FPicker » Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:43 pm

fretbuzzard wrote: Nonetheless, and while I love my thinskin, I do prefer the strat-style thread in trem arm [...].
Why? What about it do you prefer??

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by fretbuzzard » Mon Jul 13, 2009 7:55 pm

FPicker wrote:
fretbuzzard wrote: Nonetheless, and while I love my thinskin, I do prefer the strat-style thread in trem arm [...].
Why? What about it do you prefer??
A couple of things, I guess.  The fact that it screws in gives you a bit of adjustability in terms of height--this makes it a bit easier to set the arm up high enough to allow for easy volume swells, etc.  Also the screw-in arm can be switched back and forth from fixed to "dangle" in a couple of seconds--depending on the song, sometimes I want it to stay close at hand, sometimes I want it to dangle more or less freely.  Finally, the screw-in setup seems a bit less dainty and finicky to me--I prefer not to worry about collet teeth etc.  But again, with the tape, my pop-in arm is working just fine!

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by OffYourFace » Mon Jul 13, 2009 10:44 pm

I have a Pat Pend tremolo assembly and the vintage arm I had would snap in ok but would not stay still.  It was swinging free once in all the way.  I like Ben's idea about bending it but ever since Justin broke his vintage trem arm, I've been afraid to do such a thing!  So what I did was, I put genereous amount of blue Loctite on the base of the trem arm and stuck it in.  It's been working great!

I used a similar technique for a 3-way toggle switch that was not working right.  I dropped a tiny amount the pin that holds the toggle to the switch.  Worked great, too!

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by RumorsOFsurF » Mon Jul 13, 2009 11:29 pm

fretbuzzard wrote:
FPicker wrote:
fretbuzzard wrote: Nonetheless, and while I love my thinskin, I do prefer the strat-style thread in trem arm [...].
Why? What about it do you prefer??
A couple of things, I guess.  The fact that it screws in gives you a bit of adjustability in terms of height--this makes it a bit easier to set the arm up high enough to allow for easy volume swells, etc.  Also the screw-in arm can be switched back and forth from fixed to "dangle" in a couple of seconds--depending on the song, sometimes I want it to stay close at hand, sometimes I want it to dangle more or less freely.  Finally, the screw-in setup seems a bit less dainty and finicky to me--I prefer not to worry about collet teeth etc.  But again, with the tape, my pop-in arm is working just fine!

All the arms on my offsets are plenty high.  I bend them all outward.  As far as being dainty or finicky,  I've held my guitar up by the arm and shook it during a heated moment in a show, and it's still going strong.  Like I said, it's all in the adjustments.  It's a lot like offset bridge setups....many people don't take the time, or just plain don't know how to set them up, so they discount them as inferior or junk, when in reality they're great designs.
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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by fretbuzzard » Tue Jul 14, 2009 7:43 am

RumorsOFsurF wrote:
fretbuzzard wrote:
FPicker wrote: Why? What about it do you prefer??
A couple of things, I guess.  The fact that it screws in gives you a bit of adjustability in terms of height--this makes it a bit easier to set the arm up high enough to allow for easy volume swells, etc.  Also the screw-in arm can be switched back and forth from fixed to "dangle" in a couple of seconds--depending on the song, sometimes I want it to stay close at hand, sometimes I want it to dangle more or less freely.  Finally, the screw-in setup seems a bit less dainty and finicky to me--I prefer not to worry about collet teeth etc.  But again, with the tape, my pop-in arm is working just fine!

All the arms on my offsets are plenty high.  I bend them all outward.  As far as being dainty or finicky,  I've held my guitar up by the arm and shook it during a heated moment in a show, and it's still going strong.  Like I said, it's all in the adjustments.  It's a lot like offset bridge setups....many people don't take the time, or just plain don't know how to set them up, so they discount them as inferior or junk, when in reality they're great designs.
Oh, I don't consider the JM trem dainty in use, it's just the adjustment that's more of a pain than with the screw-in variety.  I think the comparison to the bridge is a good one--I took the time and effort to set up my JM bridge correctly, I should probably just suck it up and do the same for the trem.  That said, for MY purposes, if it's a question of which design is more user friendly, the strat trem wins.  The different vibe that a JM trem gives in terms of feel and sound makes it worth the effort to set it up properly, but it IS more effort.

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by crazyzeke » Tue Jul 14, 2009 8:05 am

RumorsOFsurF wrote: I don't disagree that others have had problems, but a proper fix is much better to me than half-assing it with tape.
Don't forget that in some cases people tape their arm so it sits higher in the slot, myself included.  I also bent the curved part of the arm upwards to allow for more range.  It's a credit to the design that the tuning stability is really good even after doing this.
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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by essdubb » Tue Jul 14, 2009 10:24 am

i read in a book i have that Fender sells a small spring that you put in the arm hole for screw in type trem arms.  i believe this puts upward pressure on the trem arm keeping the threads snug and keeping the arm where you leave it.  not sure if it's just for screw in.

http://www.fender.com/products//search. ... 0994931000
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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by OffYourFace » Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:01 am

essdubb wrote: i read in a book i have that Fender sells a small spring that you put in the arm hole for screw in type trem arms.  i believe this puts upward pressure on the trem arm keeping the threads snug and keeping the arm where you leave it.  not sure if it's just for screw in.

http://www.fender.com/products//search. ... 0994931000

I agree with the below statement from Callahamguitars.com - cause it happened o me once

"The Fender solution is a heavy spring in the bottom of the block. This spring causes the threads to gall and suddenly the arm is locked in the block and the only way to remove it is to break it off. Most people loss this spring without even knowing it, which is good. But trying to replace it is a mistake."

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by essdubb » Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:31 am

I don't think the spring is intended to lock the trem arm in there, though I'm sure it happens.

In my experience Callaham tend to overstate the effectiveness of their parts.  I had a tele bridge from them once that was touted as the second coming and would "increase sustain by 8%".  8-freakin-percent!  They even calculated it!!  It was good but not nearly as good as they make it sound.  Kinda like how golf equipment companies try to make you believe their nuclear-powered liquid core balls will turn you into Tiger. 

It's all in the hands.
Last edited by essdubb on Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by OffYourFace » Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:39 pm

essdubb wrote: I don't think the spring is intended to lock the trem arm in there, though I'm sure it happens.

In my experience Callaham tend to overstate the effectiveness of their parts.  I had a tele bridge from them once that was touted as the second coming and would "increase sustain by 8%".  8-freakin-percent!  They even calculated it!!  It was good but not nearly as good as they make it sound.  Kinda like how golf equipment companies try to make you believe their nuclear-powered liquid core balls will turn you into Tiger. 

It's all in the hands.

It's not meant to lock the arm in there, it's just a unfortunate possibility.  It's not a common occurrence though.  Eventually the threads wear and you end up screwing the arm further in.  The spring prevents you from going further, causing you to strip the area of threading just above the spring.  This happened to me and I couldn't get the arm out.  This was a vintage reissue bridge from the early '90s.

The "8% increase in sustain" only refers to employing the top 2 little screws (above the pickup, closer to the neck).  They just give you the option to use them for maximum resonance.  It's an old trick that the 'B' bender players came up with.  I use it myself on my Tele Custom.  I would say that the Callaham Tele Bridge provides 20% more sustain than the current stock Fender Reissue bridge but I'm no expert!  :)

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Re: Tremelo Arm: Screw-In vs. Snap-in ??

Post by essdubb » Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:43 pm

AH!  I never put those 2 little screw in!  Makes a bit more sense now.
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