Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

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Amon 7.L
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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Amon 7.L » Sun May 26, 2019 5:27 am

Futuron wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 3:12 am
If I can be allowed to butt in, I think it's possible as below, assuming by "both" that you mean in parallel, not series.

Neck switch goes on, off, reverse (as per mustang usual).
Bridge switch goes hh, off, coil split.

Image

Colours for humbucker wires are Seymour Duncan, everything else I just made up to differentiate, in case you were wondering.
Thank you, Futuron.
Yes, I meant both in parallel, not series
I don't know how to interact your diagram with the pots, am I correct if I do this?
Image

My main concern is about how I've linked the switches to each other their way to the volume pot.
Also, can I ground the switches to their cases or should I run them separately down to the back of the volume pot?

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Futuron » Thu May 30, 2019 5:41 am

Amon 7.L wrote:
Sun May 26, 2019 5:27 am
I don't know how to interact your diagram with the pots, am I correct if I do this?
Image

My main concern is about how I've linked the switches to each other their way to the volume pot.
Also, can I ground the switches to their cases or should I run them separately down to the back of the volume pot?
So yeah, the yellow hot "output" wires need to join somewhere and go to the volume pot - as you've done.

The blue "ground" ones need to make it to the output jack's sleeve (as do the pots, switch cases, bridge, shielding). It is a common practice to just connect everything straight to the back of the volume pot. It is also common to instead connect things in a line like a railway. So if you connect the switch "ground" outputs together and to the switch cases (as you have in your diagram), you need to also have 1 of those connect to the volume pot case, and a connection from that to the tone pot case (so that it all joins up with the jack). IE join your blue lines contiguously.

Here is the normal Mustang wiring for reference (note it omits bridge ground connection):
Image


BTW I always get confused regarding which pot terminals to use, especially when things are flipped around, so don't ask me if they are the right way around! :whistle:



And of course if you want a switch to operate in the opposite direction just flip it horizontally.
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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Thu May 30, 2019 8:09 pm

Futuron wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 5:41 am
BTW I always get confused regarding which pot terminals to use, especially when things are flipped around, so don't ask me if they are the right way around! :whistle:
The pots are correctly drawn ;)
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http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=104282&p=1438384#p1438384

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Amon 7.L » Fri May 31, 2019 3:56 am

Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 8:09 pm
Futuron wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 5:41 am
BTW I always get confused regarding which pot terminals to use, especially when things are flipped around, so don't ask me if they are the right way around! :whistle:
The pots are correctly drawn ;)
Thanks a lot, guys :w00t:

I've update the schematic, if this is correct, this weekend I might be able to start soldering :w00t:

Image

P.S.:
Disregard my note about flipping the schematic "before action", it's just a note for me that I'm working with a left handed set-up ;)

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by min7b5 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:13 am

Hey shadow,

Off the top of your head do you think this would be a possible scheme that would fit inside the current cavity?

Own a JMJM if that matters.

Lead circuit:
largely unchanged,
3way works as normal, master vol, master tone
Added in a phase slider switch beside the current slider ( so there are two slider switches total)
Master vol/tone engaged when phase switch is on or off.

Rhythm circuit:
Slider turns into series/parallel switch
Rollers become PBT tone controls
Master vol active when series switch is engaged
Master tone is disengaged

Concept:
PBT rollers are only active when series switch is active.
Series switch engages the 2nd cct much like the old rhythm cct worked, except that the master volume is still active. Phase switch would also be able to be active when series is turned on.

Still going through it all in my head for how it could work. I believe it's a neat concept pulling in a few different ideas but tweaked for personal preference.

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:58 pm

Min7b5, sorry dude. I've been ridiculously busy. I haven't been ignoring you, and haven't forgotten you.

I'm still sort of "decoding" what you want to do. It can definitely be done, but my initial thoughts are that it might take more switches that you're currently wanting it to. I'll have to go through it a bit more thoroughly though. I'll be honest here, to get specific pots to work in specific modes, would be MUCH easier with a big rotary switch that separate sliders, but I'll see what I can come up with.
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http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=104282&p=1438384#p1438384

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by min7b5 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:21 am

Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:58 pm
Min7b5, sorry dude. I've been ridiculously busy. I haven't been ignoring you, and haven't forgotten you.

I'm still sort of "decoding" what you want to do. It can definitely be done, but my initial thoughts are that it might take more switches that you're currently wanting it to. I'll have to go through it a bit more thoroughly though. I'll be honest here, to get specific pots to work in specific modes, would be MUCH easier with a big rotary switch that separate sliders, but I'll see what I can come up with.
No worries! Any help is appreciated. I should make a truth table with all the modes but good point on the Rotary.

I may even have thoughts on how to simplify it, but it's all theoretical now. I

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by min7b5 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:00 am

New refined concept with I think simplifies the process,
Again, not sure if it would even be feasible from a spacial point of view,

Slight changes from before, it'll have master vol and tone in every position. When series is active, the bass cut will be active as well

Hoping this makes sense.
One roller would turn into a slider. Maybe these can be done with DPDT and nothing more complex.

Switch table here:
https://imgur.com/a/Sg85LCK

Edited for correctness:
https://imgur.com/a/SXmOAfE

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by ID454 » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:19 pm

Hey, Ive been doing a build for a jazzmaster based a bit off of your mustang 5.0 and other diagrams and wanted to post what i had done up.
Also its fair to mention this was my first attempt at doing any wiring or soldering myself so any success on my part felt like a complete victory.
First of all it does what I'm looking to do but there were some weird side effects that i noticed as well as a few dead spots. I was hoping some insight if you or anyone had some.

The weirdest behavior is when i have the hot rod switch up and the pickups in phase but also the series switch engaged. In this position it seems that the volume and tone pot both do some sort of tone shaping. When i have the at 10 i dont get any(much) hum but as i roll them off some harshness and hum is introduced...kinda like the highs are rolled off a bit when the knobs are at 10. I'm wondering if it has to do with the switches or the wiring around the pots. I did not design this volume and tone wiring part of it but only drew up how it was configured when i opened it up and i just left all that the same.

Any ways heres the diagram i drew up and wired up. Please forgive any sloppiness or if i broke a bunch of diagram drawing best practices, as i said its my first time.
Image
EDIT: i forgot to draw it but all the ground leads to go to the tone pot so there is a ground...just forgot to draw that connection...

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by min7b5 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:31 am

ID454 wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:19 pm
Hey, Ive been doing a build for a jazzmaster based a bit off of your mustang 5.0 and other diagrams and wanted to post what i had done up.
Also its fair to mention this was my first attempt at doing any wiring or soldering myself so any success on my part felt like a complete victory.
First of all it does what I'm looking to do but there were some weird side effects that i noticed as well as a few dead spots. I was hoping some insight if you or anyone had some.

The weirdest behavior is when i have the hot rod switch up and the pickups in phase but also the series switch engaged. In this position it seems that the volume and tone pot both do some sort of tone shaping. When i have the at 10 i dont get any(much) hum but as i roll them off some harshness and hum is introduced...kinda like the highs are rolled off a bit when the knobs are at 10. I'm wondering if it has to do with the switches or the wiring around the pots. I did not design this volume and tone wiring part of it but only drew up how it was configured when i opened it up and i just left all that the same.

Any ways heres the diagram i drew up and wired up. Please forgive any sloppiness or if i broke a bunch of diagram drawing best practices, as i said its my first time.
[img]https://i.imgur.com/i2ht4Zl.png[/im g]
EDIT: i forgot to draw it but all the ground leads to go to the tone pot so there is a ground...just forgot to draw that connection...
A really good thing to do that would help is to build a truth table showing what switching is supposed to result in what. Ie, toggle up, is neck.
Then, Look to my post just up a one that shows what mine would look like.

Then,
You can take a multimeter if you have one and measure the resistance at the output jack while switching all the different modes. From that you can determine if any of the modes are not operating correctly.

Ie, if one mode is neck only, and it's resistance is 4kOhm, then the resistance should show 4kOhm. if it shows 8k (neck 4k, bridge 4k) then the two Pups are actually in series. So there is a fault.

Alternatively, maybe there are some grounding issues.

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by ID454 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:27 pm

Well, funny thing... now thinking about what i just posted i should have just gone with the 7th or 8th diagram down in the OP.

Solo switch with the phase and series parallel that i wanted....Oh well i guess i just get added options at the expense of some confusion.
min7b5 wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 9:31 am
A really good thing to do that would help is to build a truth table showing what switching is supposed to result in what. Ie, toggle up, is neck.
...
You can take a multimeter if you have one and measure the resistance at the output jack while switching all the different modes. From that you can determine if any of the modes are not operating correctly.
...
Alternatively, maybe there are some grounding issues.
Thanks for those tips i do think ill make a table and try and figure out what i did.

Any way to measure other things other than series/parr? something like the highs or lows at least relative to its self using a multimeter?
I could measure it with a spectrum analyzer but I don't know how i would introduce a reference tone or signal other than just trying to strum continuously at the same amplitude. maybe getting too into what they do to generate a pickup or guitar model over at line 6 but it would be interesting to know if there is a known method of this to help with tonal sculpting at some level of precision.

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:16 pm

ID454 wrote:
Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:27 pm
Well, funny thing... now thinking about what i just posted i should have just gone with the 7th or 8th diagram down in the OP.

Solo switch with the phase and series parallel that i wanted....Oh well i guess i just get added options at the expense of some confusion.
That schematic will work for you? I looked over what you drew up briefly, but last night at work was nuts. I wasn't sure the things you were going for specifically (phase, series-parallel, etc.).

And min7b5, I haven't forgotten you! I'm hoping to get another schematic done this weekend, and I'll look over yours then, unless some time is freed up during the week this week.
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http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=104282&p=1438384#p1438384

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by ID454 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:51 pm

Initially what I wanted was the jazz switch with the master volume and tone still functional but I’ve been digging the hot rodded neck so I think that the solo switch with the phase and series switches would do well for me. A little less confusing possibly and without the odd side effects I’m seeing from my diagram.
All things considered, I’m getting some awesome tones out of that wiring just need wrap my brain around it for a while longer.
Ill probably try out your way of it soon and see how it compares.
Thanks!

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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:54 pm

No problem! Let me/us know if you decide to change some things!
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Re: Shadoweclipse13's Master Schematic Page!

Post by Rgand » Wed Jun 26, 2019 5:01 am

I thought this thread was pinned but it seems to be working its way down the list. It's a very useful thread. Shouldn't it be pinned at the top?

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