Got myself a blackface Princeton

Make it loud here.
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DeathJag
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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by DeathJag » Wed May 15, 2019 9:08 am

i love sharin foo wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 6:40 pm
You guys wore me down.... I just bought a '62 6G2 :fp:
Wow, exactly the year I'd love to have! That's my favorite year for Fender amps. Eventually I hope to acquire one too.

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by i love sharin foo » Wed May 15, 2019 10:10 am

shadowplay wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 5:46 am
Aww two cool amps bought and sounds like they have gone to the best of homes. I've always wanted a Princeton but never had one in my path and only have a Deluxe.

Congrats.

D
Thanks!

I am realigning some of my gear priorities. I’ve wanted a brown faced one for a long time now. The little bastards have doubled in price since then. I figured I better just do it! It should make a nice pair with the ‘66 non-reverb one. I’ll have a couple little things to do with the 6G2 right off.. caps, grounded cord, etc. I can’t wait!
"There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine..."

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by kosmonautmayhem » Wed May 15, 2019 10:22 am

Good excuse to link this old thread.

http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... 10&t=75497

6G2 is probably my favorite amp. I went through some mania a few years back when I have a bunch of them at the same time. At one point I had three 6G2s (two brown and one black) and my 72 PR.

Now I only have the Tuxedo 6G2 and the PR. (and my blonde reverb unit). Two PRs together is a beautiful thing btw.

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by StevenO » Wed May 15, 2019 4:21 pm

You're going to love it, Justin! It's not for every occasion and it will be very different than your other amps, but it's got a great sound to it.

Here's mine, fresh from the repair shop and sounding honky and wonderful:

Image

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by i love sharin foo » Wed May 15, 2019 6:22 pm

StevenO wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:21 pm
You're going to love it, Justin! It's not for every occasion and it will be very different than your other amps, but it's got a great sound to it.

Here's mine, fresh from the repair shop and sounding honky and wonderful:

Image
You got it back already! Nice!

Are there any big differences from before the surgery to after?

I can't wait until mine gets here. It's had a couple weird things done inside. Mainly involving a couple electrolytics and a stray resistor which I am not sure why it is, where it is. Everything is there though, so it shouldn't take much more than the recap and rerouting a few wires to put it back to the stock layout.

The amp dates to the last week of '62 but it has a brown rubber, "blackface" style handle. I'll be damned if I can't see any extra screw holes from the leather one that I would think it should have left the factory with. I don't THINK the chrome end caps would fully cover the old holes... would they? It wouldn't surprise me if there was a transition period with the later handle while still brownfaced, but it shouldn't have happened this early, if it did at all (just speculating here). I mean, we know the "tuxedos" had the later handle, but did they run out of the old handles before brown cabinets? I know, I know, very important things to be concerning myself with right now :fp: At any rate, I'll know soon what the case is with this one. I'm sure it should be leather :'( I just hope that there won't be too much evidence of the later handle when I swap back to the correct one. Other that, the amp appears really straight.
"There are twists of time and space, of vision and reality, which only a dreamer can divine..."

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Wed May 15, 2019 7:34 pm

i love sharin foo wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 10:10 am
I am realigning some of my gear priorities. I’ve wanted a brown faced one for a long time now. The little bastards have doubled in price since then. I figured I better just do it! It should make a nice pair with the ‘66 non-reverb one. I’ll have a couple little things to do with the 6G2 right off.. caps, grounded cord, etc. I can’t wait!
I would love to have a vintage Princeton, but as you say, prices (for gear in general lately) seem to be going up. I was thinking about getting one of those Secret Agent amps like MaggieO has. It seemed like the best of both worlds to me. Though, I just looked them up and I don't know if the guy (Pierce Custom Instruments, I think) is still in business...
Pickup Switching Mad Scientist
http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=104282&p=1438384#p1438384

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by StevenO » Thu May 16, 2019 2:52 am

i love sharin foo wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 6:22 pm
You got it back already! Nice!

Are there any big differences from before the surgery to after?

I can't wait until mine gets here. It's had a couple weird things done inside. Mainly involving a couple electrolytics and a stray resistor which I am not sure why it is, where it is. Everything is there though, so it shouldn't take much more than the recap and rerouting a few wires to put it back to the stock layout.

The amp dates to the last week of '62 but it has a brown rubber, "blackface" style handle. I'll be damned if I can't see any extra screw holes from the leather one that I would think it should have left the factory with. I don't THINK the chrome end caps would fully cover the old holes... would they? It wouldn't surprise me if there was a transition period with the later handle while still brownfaced, but it shouldn't have happened this early, if it did at all (just speculating here). I mean, we know the "tuxedos" had the later handle, but did they run out of the old handles before brown cabinets? I know, I know, very important things to be concerning myself with right now :fp: At any rate, I'll know soon what the case is with this one. I'm sure it should be leather :'( I just hope that there won't be too much evidence of the later handle when I swap back to the correct one. Other that, the amp appears really straight.
The biggest thing I've noticed is how quiet it now it. Before, with the old parts, it hummed like crazy and at a frequency that would get in the way of some notes, that's how loud and ominous it would be. It was really annoying and at times it would be bordering on unusable. Now it's quiet up and down the volume dial, which is exactly what I had hoped. Other than that, it's hard to say how different it is sound-wise... I think it definitely sounds better, just hard to know in what ways. Maybe just overall better. It sounds healthy, if that makes any sense.

One thing I think you might be a little taken back by is how tame it is in the lows. It may seem lacking in that area compared to other amps, especially a Blackface Princeton which can be quite boomy at times. But mix it with something that has a mid-scoop, like a Blackface Princeton, and there's just this lovely dimension to the sound of the two amps adding and subtracting what each other lacks. You'll enjoy that quite a bit. They also take gain pedals in a different manner than most amps, but if you think of the amp as essentially a gain pedal in and of itself, you can get away with stacking boosters into it to get what you need.

As for the handle, I wouldn't worry about that so much. These student amps were always weird in that regard. They made Tweed Champs way into the Brownface and Blackface eras, sometimes with actual Tweed coverings, other times with black tolex. I think those were easy amps to experiment with from Fender's point of view because they weren't the big show stoppers of the line, they were just for student and home use, primarily, and didn't make as much of an impact with the pros. Easier to gauge a response to changes that way perhaps.

In any case, I think you'll enjoy it quite a bit. :)

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by kosmonautmayhem » Thu May 16, 2019 6:17 am

Steven - glad you got your back as well. Happy to hear that its back in good health and most importantly - quiet! Mine is my quietest amp for sure.

The handle thing - 50/50 that its original. I've had a '63 brown with leather handle and couple '62s browns. All the browns I've ever seen have had leather handles/ But thats not to say they're aren't anomalies and transitions. My blonde '64 reverb unit has a brown plastic handle, gold grill and smooth blonde tolex.

Would be interested in seeing some gut shot when yours comes. I'm curious whats been modified.

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by i love sharin foo » Thu May 16, 2019 6:29 am

kosmonautmayhem wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:17 am
Steven - glad you got your back as well. Happy to hear that its back in good health and most importantly - quiet! Mine is my quietest amp for sure.

The handle thing - 50/50 that its original. I've had a '63 brown with leather handle and couple '62s browns. All the browns I've ever seen have had leather handles/ But thats not to say they're aren't anomalies and transitions. My blonde '64 reverb unit has a brown plastic handle, gold grill and smooth blonde tolex.

Would be interested in seeing some gut shot when yours comes. I'm curious whats been modified.
Yeah, I’ll be interested to verify the handle one way or the other.

I’ll post some gut shots when I have it. It has been recapped already, but the cap can doesn’t appear to be correct and there was a bit of a work around in place because of that. That’s the only real issue that I can see. I’ll recap it properly myself right off with the correct can (I’m doing 30/30/30) and double check everything else against the original schematic replacing any resistors that are too far out of spec. The original film caps and everything are all still in there :) What do you recommend for the resistor in the bias circuit? I see that the schematic generally differs from what is actually in there. I’ll be interested to see what value volume pot that I end up with. Prob 1 meg I would suppose.
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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by kosmonautmayhem » Thu May 16, 2019 10:29 am

Awesome. Would love to see it!

Yours is very likely a 1M volume pot. My current '64 Tuxedo and a former '63 brown had the 250k pot. If anything the 250k is a little less loud earlier on the dial. They both sound great.

A fixed bias resistor is usually around 22k. I have a bias pot I need to reinstall. Beyond useful. I put a 22k resistor in line with a 10k lin trim pot. Then mount the pot to where the ground switch is normally. I can measure mA of my tubes ona bias meter and get them just right. Especially nice to have if you're buying used old stock tubes and trying to match them up or at least get the most of them.

I like mine biased around 17-19mA, which get me in the 375-380vdc range. Same goes for my PR, although the voltage are in the low 400s iirc.

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by StevenO » Thu May 16, 2019 10:36 am

We need to have an annual meeting of the Princetons.

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by i love sharin foo » Thu May 16, 2019 1:29 pm

StevenO wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 10:36 am
We need to have an annual meeting of the Princetons.
That would be sweet! We could have guest lecturers and everything 8) (I originally had guest speakers, but thought that might be confusing.. hehe).
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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by Maggieo » Thu May 16, 2019 1:38 pm

i love sharin foo wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 1:29 pm
StevenO wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 10:36 am
We need to have an annual meeting of the Princetons.
That would be sweet! We could have guest lecturers and everything 8) (I originally had guest speakers, but thought that might be confusing.. hehe).
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :D :D :D :D :D
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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by kosmonautmayhem » Thu May 16, 2019 2:40 pm

Should we run off and start our Princeton forum?!

There are probably enough of us for one.


Maybe just a mega Princeton thread instead??

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Re: Got myself a blackface Princeton

Post by StevenO » Thu May 16, 2019 3:55 pm

It'll have to be a secret group, these are expensive enough as is... :ph34r:

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