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Hey guys.

I have a '62 princeton and a small supro.
I almost changed the pots out from my JM and lowered them to 500k or less because it is just so darn bright through the Princeton, and that's the amp I playj the most. The other amp stays at our practice space so I don't get to play it much and don't use my JM at practice. Today I brought home the supro and tested the JM out on it, and sure enough it sounds way better. The Supro amp has more mids, in general, with all my guitars.

I guess my questions are:

1. Why would the Supro sound so much better? Does the JM need mids to tame the highs?
2. Are '62 Princetons known as bright amps? I always thought they had the reputation of being dark. What would cause the amp to sound bright? I'm wondering if I should bring it in to have serviced or this is normal for a '62 and a JM pairing. I have the original speaker in it.
3. What amp do you think makes a good pairing with the JM? I always thought a Fender...but the Supro sounds so much more balanced. I'd be curious to hear some other suggestions of amps that tame the highs and balance out a JM.

Thanks!

Hah! Scroll down in the Amp section and you'll find a Supro thread that I started. I'm also curious about others' experiences with JMs and Supros.

Couple things:
- I played my JM through a silverface Princeton reissue (10" Greenback) and holy cow was that dark and muffled. Was not expecting that. We had the bass at 0 and treble at 10 and it still was super dark. Very odd. Even the sales guy was surprised.
- Which Supro do you have? I looooove my Supro Saturn MKII with my JM but it's not really a typical Supro. Supros do have more mids and I think it does wonders for JMs.

As far as I'm concerned, if a Supro makes your JM sound better, well, just play that then!

BarnyardCoral wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:31 pm

Hah! Scroll down in the Amp section and you'll find a Supro thread that I started. I'm also curious about others' experiences with JMs and Supros.

Couple things:
- I played my JM through a silverface Princeton reissue (10" Greenback) and holy cow was that dark and muffled. Was not expecting that. We had the bass at 0 and treble at 10 and it still was super dark. Very odd. Even the sales guy was surprised.
- Which Supro do you have? I looooove my Supro Saturn MKII with my JM but it's not really a typical Supro. Supros do have more mids and I think it does wonders for JMs.

As far as I'm concerned, if a Supro makes your JM sound better, well, just play that then!

Hey awesome. I will go read that thread now.
I have the small 1622RT. Last year on Black Friday they were $650 all-in cost so I grabbed one to gig with -- it's never at home and always at my practice space, so I can't really play the JM through it very often. To me the Supro sounds like something halfway between Fender and Marshall. I really like it.

j mascis wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 1:15 pm

Hey guys.

I have a '62 princeton and a small supro.
I almost changed the pots out from my JM and lowered them to 500k or less because it is just so darn bright through the Princeton, and that's the amp I playj the most.

Have you ever tried plugging in through the #2 input? It rolls off biting treble in a very nice way.

Also, try lowering the negative feedback. I find this to be a very nice way of making Princetons sound less harsh when you push them.

tdbajus wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:11 pm

Also, try lowering the negative feedback. I find this to be a very nice way of making Princetons sound less harsh when you push them.

What is the negative feedback (I can google this), and how do I lower it?

j mascis wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:27 pm

tdbajus wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:11 pm

Also, try lowering the negative feedback. I find this to be a very nice way of making Princetons sound less harsh when you push them.

What is the negative feedback (I can google this), and how do I lower it?

If you have to ask, you should definitely have someone do it for you, because the voltages inside an amp- EVEN UNPLUGGED- can kill you dead.

But I can show you a few things that you might find interesting. Negative feedback is when you take the signal from the output of the power amp and feed a small part of it back BEFORE the power amp. Since the signal is inverted, you will be adding the inverse back in. There are people who can better explain it, and hopefully they will jump in.

Here's the Princeton:



See the line coming back from the OT with the 2700 resistor? That's it.


Check out the tweed vibrolux, which has a very similar output section:



But there is a bigger resistor- 56K- so there is less negative feedback. I think a vibrolux sounds a lot better than a stock Princeton when it distorts.

Furthermore, the tweed 5E3 deluxe (the neil young model) also has a similar output section, with NO negative feedback.



I have a handmade princeton head that I cut the negative feedback on, and she is fucking glorious.

They always sound great through pretty much any Silverface/Blackface Fender for mine.

never tried one, but maybe Fender had some bigger plan with regards to best amp & guitar pairing ( ):

Joke aside, what type/brand of JM PU's do you have in your current JM?

JC-120 or Twin!!

PJazzmaster wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 4:29 pm

Joke aside, what type/brand of JM PU's do you have in your current JM?

It's '65 AVRIs.
They're nice...just the top end into the Priceton is pretty brutal sounding.

IMO

Small - Princeton Reverbs

Medium - Deluxe Reverbs

Large - Twin Reverbs

In my experience a JM can sound brittle when clean or grainy in a bad way when driven through the wrong amp.

Fenders are usually a good match, but I can see that with a non-reverb Princeton.

I love my At Mars Specialist with almost any guitar but P90s and JM pickups sound especially nice though it. It’s a very mid-forward amp, but in a way that’s flattering and sits well in a band mix.

j mascis wrote: ↑

Thu Nov 14, 2019 5:16 pm

It's '65 AVRIs.
They're nice...just the top end into the Priceton is pretty brutal sounding.

Oh, that could be part of the problem, I like bright JM sounds but the AV65's were too bright for my taste (I didn't want to mess around with lower potentiometer values). I had a pair of AV65's in my AVRI62 JM for a while, I liked them overall better than some boutique JM PU's - with the tone rolled off - but finally went back to the stock AVRI JM PU's which I really like and they allow me too keep the amp tone knob in the middle at 5, even on a SF Princeton.

OR simply try out a VOX AC30 or AC15, those could be work well with your AV65 PU's.

I don’t think there’s a “best” and a JM can sound awesome through a mid-scooped Blackface Fender amp or a Marshall, but I also prefer more mid-range, so my favorites are a Tweed Fender or an old Vox.

I also replace my volume pots with 500k pots.