Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

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Shadoweclipse13
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:17 pm

wproffitt wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:58 am
sookwinder wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:42 am
There is a lot of knowledge and experience here at OSG with building kits and our own designs, so issues and problems can eventually be solved. or at the very least directions to be taken indicated.
David’s right. There IS a lot of knowledge and experience here! I’ve certainly looked for help from fellow forumites in the past and had some really good guidance when the amp build got challenging. I feel lucky to have such great community of people who want to help me learn.
We really do. I've been on here for a number of years, and there is SO much knowledge and so many amazing people. I'm so thankful that I found this place when I did. I will absolutely take advantage of the knowledge and ask questions or for advice if and when I build an amp.

Larsongs wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:17 am
If I understand the OP's goal is to end up with an Amp that sounds as sweet as a mint Vintage Blackface or Silverface Princeton Reverb with a budget of a $1000.00.

I've been on a similar search for an original spec mint condition Vintage Deluxe Reverb with a budget of aprox. $1500.00. I'm finding it to be unrealistic.

To Kit build build a great Amp you need great Parts. Is a budget of $1000.00 for a Princeton type Kit build enough to buy the highest quality Wood Cabinet, HW Circuit Board, Tubes, Speaker & all the other Parts? If it is, is $1500 enough for a Deluxe Reverb type Amp?

I already have a 65 DRRI. My goal is to have an Amp with that sweet Sound that rivals a mint Vintage 65 Deluxe Reverb..
I definitely wasn't expecting a mint vintage amp. My budget is a bit up in the air, but I'd definitely like to be under $1K. As for the DIY route, I could make a cabinet myself if I wanted to (and might if I go that route) as I love woodworking. The parts will cost money sure, but it would also be a learning experience too. And I'd get exactly what I wanted. I will definitely try some of the reissues.

Igorilla wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:00 am
I suppose you are located in the US, right? There is a lot of high quality options for a more than reasonable price if you don't want to built the amp yourself.

For example Lil Dawg Amps:
https://www.littledawgamps.com/prices/

As far as I understand, his WonderDawg is a single channel Deluxe reverb with some tweaks, like mids control. Lil Dawg seems to be very responsive to the needs and wishes of his customers. My bandmate has a 6G15 stand alone reverb unit built by him, and the sound and quality are excellent. You could give him a call and tell him what you want...
Thanks for the heads-up! I might send him an email in a few days and see what he says. Some of his prices seem reasonable. I like that he does some interesting hybrids a little. The WonderDawg sounds really cool. I'll have to look around his site a little more. His Brownface Princeton is calling my name a little too... The a la carte thing is a little weird to me I guess, but I could see some players wanting a high-end transformer or their own speaker. I kinda like the idea of saving a little money if you wanted your own speaker or something.

Awesome video! Thanks for linking Maggie!! That guy's got some good inspirations 8) Nice playing too. That amp sounds VERY nice. Probably a little dirtier than I'd want, but that might just be his personal settings too. I know that Tweed circuits tended to be a tad-bit dirtier/more raw than Blackface circuits.

marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:49 pm
As a member of the Swart Cult™️ I am obligated to remind you that Swart amps exist.
You know, I've always been interested in Swart amps. I know they've got some low-wattage amps. Have a model that you'd recommend in particular?
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by marqueemoon » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:40 pm

Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:17 pm
You know, I've always been interested in Swart amps. I know they've got some low-wattage amps. Have a model that you'd recommend in particular?
STR Tremolo. It's a pretty loud 5 watts with a 6V6, and you can switch out power tubes if you need more clean headroom.

It's sort of borderline with a band. Here's mine barely keeping up with my bandmate's Supro (neither amp was miced).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRkta56RHkY

I think the only effect I'm using here is a clean boost. It does take pedals well in my experience, but I'm a minimalist when it comes to effects.

I picked up a used AST for a little more volume and headroom. It's a little less spongy and the reverb a bit more hi fi. Now I have what I consider the ideal club amp and nowhere to use it. :'(

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:47 pm

marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:40 pm
Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:17 pm
You know, I've always been interested in Swart amps. I know they've got some low-wattage amps. Have a model that you'd recommend in particular?
STR Tremolo. It's a pretty loud 5 watts with a 6V6, and you can switch out power tubes if you need more clean headroom.

It's sort of borderline with a band. Here's mine barely keeping up with my bandmate's Supro (neither amp was miced).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRkta56RHkY

I think the only effect I'm using here is a clean boost. It does take pedals well in my experience, but I'm a minimalist when it comes to effects.

I picked up a used AST for a little more volume and headroom. It's a little less spongy and the reverb a bit more hi fi. Now I have what I consider the ideal club amp and nowhere to use it. :'(
At the moment I'm not too worried about it working well with a band, as it's just me at home. There might be a little playing with my daughter when we get her a drum set, but at the moment, just me. I'll have to listen to your video later (at work now)! I was looking around on the Swart site and I love the look of the updated STR Tremolo. 5 watts sounds great too! I do use effects, but here too, maybe I can find one locally to try out. The site doesn't say (unless I missed it), but is it based on a Tweed-era Fender, Brownface, or Blackface?
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by marqueemoon » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:26 pm

Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:47 pm
At the moment I'm not too worried about it working well with a band, as it's just me at home. There might be a little playing with my daughter when we get her a drum set, but at the moment, just me. I'll have to listen to your video later (at work now)! I was looking around on the Swart site and I love the look of the updated STR Tremolo. 5 watts sounds great too! I do use effects, but here too, maybe I can find one locally to try out. The site doesn't say (unless I missed it), but is it based on a Tweed-era Fender, Brownface, or Blackface?
It's not based on a specific circuit, though to my ears there is a Fender-ish flavor to the sound but with more midrange. With the boost switch in the neutral position it's a bit more sparkly/more towards "scooped", and in the treble boost position it gets more snarly which is what I like.

The big deviation from the Fender sound is in the reverb. It's more plate-like and less "clanky" which I prefer. I don't generally use big drippy reverb sounds. The tremolo sounds great too.

I'd say definitely enough for family jamz. My son is learning drums. I'm looking forward to getting to that point with him.

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Maggieo » Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:18 pm

What it’s worth, I got rid of my Swart Atomic Space Tone after I got Ty’s Secret Agent.

I hate to rub it in, but, the Secret Agent is so much better. It’s all about the Reverb circuit. It’s that fender outboard reverb put into a combo it makes it such a special amplifier. Especially since the rest of the amp is a brown face Princeton.
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Larsongs » Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:11 pm

Maggieo wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:18 pm
What it’s worth, I got rid of my Swart Atomic Space Tone after I got Ty’s Secret Agent.

I hate to rub it in, but, the Secret Agent is so much better. It’s all about the Reverb circuit. It’s that fender outboard reverb put into a combo it makes it such a special amplifier. Especially since the rest of the amp is a brown face Princeton.
Is that a pretty obscure Amp? Nothing on the Internet or YouTube?

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Maggieo » Sat Sep 26, 2020 9:23 am

Larsongs wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 9:11 pm
Maggieo wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:18 pm
What it’s worth, I got rid of my Swart Atomic Space Tone after I got Ty’s Secret Agent.

I hate to rub it in, but, the Secret Agent is so much better. It’s all about the Reverb circuit. It’s that fender outboard reverb put into a combo it makes it such a special amplifier. Especially since the rest of the amp is a brown face Princeton.
Is that a pretty obscure Amp? Nothing on the Internet or YouTube?
It's a one-off prototype.

Ty Pierce's promo.

Quick and dirty amp demo. Recorded on an ancient iPhone.

My friend Pat playing Nelvis through the S/A.

Patrick Bradley plays PIERCE CUSTOM INSTRUMENTS SECRET AGENT AMP/FENDER ELVIS COSTELLO JAZZMASTER
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by marqueemoon » Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:25 pm

That’s a good sounding amp. I still prefer the Swart verb though. I just makes a nice little pillow for the guitar to sit on.

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Unicorn Warrior » Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:31 pm

With the used market in mind and with a budget of up to $1500, have you thought about Swart amps? Aren't those Fender-ish? They've always sounded delicious to me and are super compact and pretty sexy to top it off.

Maybe Tone King amps make a princeton-ish? Not sure their prices.

FWIW, the Stapleton Princeton can be had for cheaper on the used market. My thing is that it differs a lot from a typical Princeton. You can easily find a silverface Princeton for $1500 or under, and maybe even a blackface. But, I'm with you in regards of not wanting to wait years for it. Life is short, get an amp and play.

Also, the modern reissue Princeton are pretty solid and are gigged by the pros every day. Lots of options beyond what has been mentioned in this thread honestly. I had a 69' non-reverb sliver face Princeton which was much different characteristically than the modern reissues. Still a good/clean fender amp..but not as sparkly.

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Maggieo » Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:00 am

marqueemoon wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:25 pm
That’s a good sounding amp. I still prefer the Swart verb though. I just makes a nice little pillow for the guitar to sit on.
The Brilliance of the secret agent is that the Reverb can be set to sound just like the Swart.
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Larsongs » Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:39 pm

Maggieo wrote:
Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:00 am
marqueemoon wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:25 pm
That’s a good sounding amp. I still prefer the Swart verb though. I just makes a nice little pillow for the guitar to sit on.
The Brilliance of the secret agent is that the Reverb can be set to sound just like the Swart.
Good that you like what you've got.. But, they don't seem that brilliant to me. Why aren't people playing them? If they're that brilliant why aren't they available anywhere?

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Maggieo » Mon Sep 28, 2020 3:31 pm

Larsongs wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 2:39 pm
Maggieo wrote:
Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:00 am
marqueemoon wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 7:25 pm
That’s a good sounding amp. I still prefer the Swart verb though. I just makes a nice little pillow for the guitar to sit on.
The Brilliance of the secret agent is that the Reverb can be set to sound just like the Swart.
Good that you like what you've got.. But, they don't seem that brilliant to me. Why aren't people playing them? If they're that brilliant why aren't they available anywhere?
Because Ty only one and then got out of the pedal/amp business, that's why. It's like Richter Amps- the components were all the best they could get, but they couldn't sell those amps at a lard profit margin, and when one of them died, the company just closed up.

I had both the Swart AST and the STR, concurrent with the Secret Agent, and after a couple of years of playing them side-by-side, the S/A just got used more. It's a shame that Ty gave up on the pedal and amp business.
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:06 am

marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:26 pm
It's not based on a specific circuit, though to my ears there is a Fender-ish flavor to the sound but with more midrange. With the boost switch in the neutral position it's a bit more sparkly/more towards "scooped", and in the treble boost position it gets more snarly which is what I like.

The big deviation from the Fender sound is in the reverb. It's more plate-like and less "clanky" which I prefer. I don't generally use big drippy reverb sounds. The tremolo sounds great too.

I'd say definitely enough for family jamz. My son is learning drums. I'm looking forward to getting to that point with him.
Interesting. It definitely would be something I'd like to try, if I can find one locally. I've got a really nice shop near me, but their amp selection is mostly new, and mostly non-boutique, except a couple used amps sold here and there.

Maggieo wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:18 pm
What it’s worth, I got rid of my Swart Atomic Space Tone after I got Ty’s Secret Agent.

I hate to rub it in, but, the Secret Agent is so much better. It’s all about the Reverb circuit. It’s that fender outboard reverb put into a combo it makes it such a special amplifier. Especially since the rest of the amp is a brown face Princeton.
You know me, Maggie. I've always lusted for the Secret Agent. In that spirit, I think a DIY would be awesome. I could try to get it similar. I was actually considering making an amp with a standalone spring reverb like an old Fender reverb unit, but built into the amp.

Unicorn Warrior wrote:
Sat Sep 26, 2020 10:31 pm
With the used market in mind and with a budget of up to $1500, have you thought about Swart amps? Aren't those Fender-ish? They've always sounded delicious to me and are super compact and pretty sexy to top it off.

Maybe Tone King amps make a princeton-ish? Not sure their prices.

FWIW, the Stapleton Princeton can be had for cheaper on the used market. My thing is that it differs a lot from a typical Princeton. You can easily find a silverface Princeton for $1500 or under, and maybe even a blackface. But, I'm with you in regards of not wanting to wait years for it. Life is short, get an amp and play.

Also, the modern reissue Princeton are pretty solid and are gigged by the pros every day. Lots of options beyond what has been mentioned in this thread honestly. I had a 69' non-reverb sliver face Princeton which was much different characteristically than the modern reissues. Still a good/clean fender amp..but not as sparkly.
I hadn't actually thought about them until marqueemoon brought them up. I remember loving the aesthetics when they first came out, and thinking that the sounded pretty good. Tone King is another that makes killer stuff. I've seen a few Reverb and Chicago Music Exchange videos that used one. I do remember thinking that the Tone King stuff was pricey, and possibly still out of my price range, but it's worth a look.

Completely agree that I'd rather get something and just play it, instead of hunting forever. I have some things that I've been hunting long-term, but it's a fun hunt (antiques, old books, etc.), but amps are something I'd rather just have. I've always figured that there was some mojo in the old Fender amps that was missing in the reissues, based on some of the players around here who are more experienced with that stuff than I am. I would definitely consider a reissue though, if I liked it.
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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by sookwinder » Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:48 am

Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:06 am
You know me, Maggie. I've always lusted for the Secret Agent. In that spirit, I think a DIY would be awesome. I could try to get it similar. I was actually considering making an amp with a standalone spring reverb like an old Fender reverb unit, but built into the amp.
You could always build your own reverb unit (as well).
http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... hp?t=83932
relaxing alternative to doing actual work ...

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Re: Gassing For A Classic Fender Type Amp

Post by Igorilla » Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:56 am

sookwinder wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 4:48 am
Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Thu Oct 01, 2020 2:06 am
You know me, Maggie. I've always lusted for the Secret Agent. In that spirit, I think a DIY would be awesome. I could try to get it similar. I was actually considering making an amp with a standalone spring reverb like an old Fender reverb unit, but built into the amp.
You could always build your own reverb unit (as well).
http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... hp?t=83932
Or buy a (FET based) surfy bear reverb unit which is shockingly close to stand alone tube reverb unit (from my experince with a '63 unit, a RI reverb unit, Gomez G-Spring unit und Lil Dawg reverb unit which are all 6G15 circuit)

https://www.surfyindustries.com/

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