moar inputs

[marqueemoon]

I've decided for 2024 I'm going to offload some gear that's been gathering dust and expand my setup so I can track a whole band. Considering I'm in 3 of them it's about time. 

One of the big challenges is my practice space is the only suitable place to be loud, but isn't conducive to having a more permanent recording setup, so it's a "pack it in, pack it out" situation. I won't mind bringing in my 8U rack of better stuff if we're doing something serious, but it's pretty heavy and awkward, so I don't want to do it every time. I have 4 channels of preamps (Great River MP2-NV and Focusrite ISA Two) that I quite like and they're the heart of my setup at home.

Trying to decide how to go about doing this, but here is the plan that makes the most sense to me currently. 

Step 1. Buy a new interface with 8 onboard mic pres and ADAT input, use with my 4 channels of "good" outboard pres via TRS inputs at home, but still have a portable single rack space thing I can easily cart back and forth to the practice space. I even have a soft sided single space rack rack kicking around I can use for this.
Step 2. Down the road buy 4 more channels of "good" pres and add an A>D /D>A converter for ADAT input to the interface to eventually bring my overall input count to 16.

My current front runner is the Focusrite Clarett+ 8Pre, but I'm open to other suggestions. I'd like to stick to USB. Thunderbolt doesn't seem to be going anywhere for the moment, but yeah. I'd like to keep the interface <$1K. It really seems like much beyond that manufacturers focus on expandability over onboard capabilities, which makes total sense.

I've started researching the conversion piece and it seems my options if I don't also want onboard preamps are something older, something considerably more expensive, or this. What's surprised me in looking at the older options from Apogee, Lucid, etc... is how expensive just buying an XLR female>DB25 harness would be to get my preamps connected to it. Maybe the Black Lion is the way to go and I just need to get over my aversion to the font/logo. I know fuckall about clocking, so any wisdom in that area is much appreciated. Maybe by the time I'm ready to make that jump there will be other/better options.

Any other advice from people who have gone down this road would be great.

[øøøøøøø]

Clocking can either work, or not work.

When it doesn’t work, you’ll have clicks and pops and sometimes audibly degraded sound besides

When it works, sometimes people debate the finer points of jitter, etc and swear that this-or-that expensive external clock has made their rig sound vastly better. Usually after they’ve just spent lots of money on said device.

That’s not to imply that it can’t matter—I’m sure it can—but for what you’re doing it’s probably not worth looking for much beyond “it works”

In theory, any external clock will impart more jitter than a decent internal clock because the external clock must be received via a phase-locked loop, which is inherently more-jittery than any decent clock.

But that doesn’t mean that we won’t prefer it. Maybe we *like* jitter(?)

Anyway, all of that is “blah blah blah” to me these days. Get it working and record some music

[marqueemoon]

Clocking can either work, or not work.

When it doesn’t work, you’ll have clicks and pops and sometimes audibly degraded sound besides

When it works, sometimes people debate the finer points of jitter, etc and swear that this-or-that expensive external clock has made their rig sound vastly better. Usually after they’ve just spent lots of money on said device.

That’s not to imply that it can’t matter—I’m sure it can—but for what you’re doing it’s probably not worth looking for much beyond “it works”

In theory, any external clock will impart more jitter than a decent internal clock because the external clock must be received via a phase-locked loop, which is inherently more-jittery than any decent clock.

But that doesn’t mean that we won’t prefer it. Maybe we *like* jitter(?)

Anyway, all of that is “blah blah blah” to me these days. Get it working and record some music

I have definitely experienced the clocking related clicks and pops when recording with other people. It’s a drag.

It also seems like in its most basic form clocking is done through the ADAT connection? Basic desktop interfaces from UA, Audient, etc… don’t even have BNC connections for clock.

Yeah, I really want to prioritize portability and ease of use to get to the music making part.
One thing I’ve realized is that convenience is often the difference between recording an idea or not.

[øøøøøøø]

ADAT optical protocol is a very good and very common way of transmitting clock. It’s what I use in my home studio. It does have both advantages and disadvantages.

The big advantage is that it’s optical and transmitted by fiber optics, transmitting only a digital bitstream. As long as it’s working, it’s working—no fussy analog stages or cable impedances to worry about.

The big downside is that it can only transmit a finite amount of information in real-time: 8 channels at 24 bit 48kHz (higher sample rates available through SMUX, which is essentially just two ADAT connections).

I recommend also doing a bit of internet research about MADI

[marqueemoon]

ADAT optical protocol is a very good and very common way of transmitting clock. It’s what I use in my home studio. It does have both advantages and disadvantages.

The big advantage is that it’s optical and transmitted by fiber optics, transmitting only a digital bitstream. As long as it’s working, it’s working—no fussy analog stages or cable impedances to worry about.

The big downside is that it can only transmit a finite amount of information in real-time: 8 channels at 24 bit 48kHz (higher sample rates available through SMUX, which is essentially just two ADAT connections).

I recommend also doing a bit of internet research about MADI

Cool. 24/48 is probably good enough for now.

I really know nothing about MADI. I've encountered it looking at a few of RME's products, but that's it. I'll look into it more.

[Dok]

Those Claretts are pretty good! And hard to screw up. The only thing I don't like about them is no polarity flip or high pass filter on each channel, but both of those things can be easily done in post! They sound great and are easily expandible. I say get one and start making records.

[marqueemoon]

Those Claretts are pretty good! And hard to screw up. The only thing I don't like about them is no polarity flip or high pass filter on each channel, but both of those things can be easily done in post! They sound great and are easily expandible. I say get one and start making records.

Cool. Their mixer/control software seems pretty intuitive. I think the “air” option gets switched on an off in there, but I’m not sure about anything else.

Time to start unloading some stuff.

[OffYourFace]

I currently have the Apogee Ensemble Thunderbolt. It's been great to me. They don't make it anymore though...

If I had the money to upgrade, i'd probably get THIS and an 8 ch 500 series/lunchbox setup. But I don't have the money or a true need.

I'm sure the Clarett is great. That's a great price. It's also crazy that the Red 8Line is triple the price... like how much better can it be? It also has fans installed. I'm always wary of gear with fans built in.

[marqueemoon]

I currently have the Apogee Ensemble Thunderbolt. It's been great to me. They don't make it anymore though...

If I had the money to upgrade, i'd probably get THIS and an 8 ch 500 series/lunchbox setup. But I don't have the money or a true need.

I'm sure the Clarett is great. That's a great price. It's also crazy that the Red 8Line is triple the price... like how much better can it be? It also has fans installed. I'm always wary of gear with fans built in.

Cranborne Audio does an 8 slot 500 series rack that’s also an interface and monitor controller.
If I had already gone down the 500 series road that would be a strong candidate.

It seems almost everything that interests me these days is 500 series or available in that format, so maybe I will go that route down the road.

[redchapterjubilee]

I use a clarett with a scarlet via ADAT connection for 16 inputs. Works without issue. I don’t run 96k though. 48/24 is good enough for me

[JamesSGBrown]

I'm in the midst of rebuying recording gear...

I've got an Apollo Twin Duo (best musical purchase I've ever made). When I recorded/mixed our second record (Here's a song): https://youtu.be/v-5bNMzJOsM?si=-PBwPivdsqSZSxnm, I added an Audient ASP800 via ADAT and it did exactly what I wanted. This time around I'm going for the EVO 8 SP due to the wicked auto-gain option, the 8 'outs' for using outboard, and the price (£399 here, which is crazy for the features).

[marqueemoon]

I'm in the midst of rebuying recording gear...

I've got an Apollo Twin Duo (best musical purchase I've ever made). When I recorded/mixed our second record (Here's a song): https://youtu.be/v-5bNMzJOsM?si=-PBwPivdsqSZSxnm, I added an Audient ASP800 via ADAT and it did exactly what I wanted. This time around I'm going for the EVO 8 SP due to the wicked auto-gain option, the 8 'outs' for using outboard, and the price (£399 here, which is crazy for the features).

My friend has that exact combo (Apollo Twin and EVO 8 SP). I helped him record a demo with it. The EVO felt a little cheap, but sounded clean and transparent, and the auto gain works as advertised. Seems pretty hard to beat for the money.

I guess everything I’ve been looking at has multiple outs. I don’t have a lot of outboard gear other than compressors and preamps, but that could still be fun I guess.

[marqueemoon]

The RME OctaMic II is looking pretty interesting to me. Would it be weird to put the bulk of the budget into that and just go with a cheap basic interface that supports ADAT in?

That seems a bit more “future proof” to me, and the fact that you get analog outs in addition to a few digital options is pretty slick. I can think of a lot of ways to use the analog outs for monitoring when live tracking in the practice space.

[JamesSGBrown]

I'm in the midst of rebuying recording gear...

I've got an Apollo Twin Duo (best musical purchase I've ever made). When I recorded/mixed our second record (Here's a song): https://youtu.be/v-5bNMzJOsM?si=-PBwPivdsqSZSxnm, I added an Audient ASP800 via ADAT and it did exactly what I wanted. This time around I'm going for the EVO 8 SP due to the wicked auto-gain option, the 8 'outs' for using outboard, and the price (£399 here, which is crazy for the features).

My friend has that exact combo (Apollo Twin and EVO 8 SP). I helped him record a demo with it. The EVO felt a little cheap, but sounded clean and transparent, and the auto gain works as advertised. Seems pretty hard to beat for the money.

I guess everything I’ve been looking at has multiple outs. I don’t have a lot of outboard gear other than compressors and preamps, but that could still be fun I guess.

I'm springing for the Apollo x 4 (replacing my decade-old Twin Duo) and the ASP800s again I think. Though the SSL Quad Drive Pre's look SO good, but they're a bit over-budget despite being keenly priced for what they are.

[marqueemoon]

One of our practice space mates generously offered to let us all use his 4 input Scarlett and Behringer ADAT expander preamp for recordings in our space.

I haven't tested it yet, but it should work fine for the purpose of doing some quick and dirty demos in the space. Since that's the main situation where more inputs are needed I'm going to postpone upgrading my interface for the time being.

I still want to eventually increase the input count on my home setup, but it's nice to no longer feel rushed about it.