Early 70's Jazzmasters

Discussion of vintage Jazzmasters, Jaguars, Bass VIs, Electric XIIs and any other offset-waist instruments.
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sloobkof
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Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by sloobkof » Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:46 pm

I have a buddy in Sweden (I am from the US) who has owned 6-7 pre-1964 Jazzmasters over the years. As a proud owner of a 90's MIJ Jazzmaster, I recently asked him if he thought his older JMs sounded significantly better than newer ones... to which he responded, "I have no idea, I have never played one younger than '64."

Lucky guy.

That wasn't completely true, however. I showed him a 1973 Olympic White model for sale on the internet and he told me that has played a few early 70's JMs and found them to be "lifeless", lacking the "vibrance" he was used to. By lifeless he said they just didn't feel good whilst playing.

My ideal JM would have the following characteristics (some are silly, esthetic visual notes... but we are talking dream guitar):

1) Olympic White
2) Banded Neck
3) Yellowed, checked & worn naturally
4) Warm sounding. Not high pitched and not prone to squeals. Setting the guitar volume to 10 sounds good.
5) Enlarged strat-like headstock
6) Wood colored headstock
7) Dot inlays, not rectanglular

My Questions to community members:

1) Do early 70's models sound and feel inferior to other eras?
2) Do early 70's models have enlarged headstocks or am I just "seeing things"?
3) Does this guitar I dream of actually exist (I actually not hung up on year nor value)?
4) Do '60s and '70s JMs sound significantly better than 80's, 90's, etc. models?

Thank you!

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adamrobertt
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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by adamrobertt » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:00 pm

1) Not sure if Olympic White was still offered in the early 70s... it may have been, it may not have been. Someone in here can pipe up... but I know that custom colors got less common in general after the end of the 60s.
2) Flamed necks are out there, but I don't think they're super common. Fender wasn't exactly selecting necks for flame, it was just luck of the draw. I think even in the 60s it was considered ugly.
3) You're probably good there, lol.
4) Some of your terminology here is weird to me. IMO any guitar can sound good, and I doubt the pickups in the early 70s were much different at all from the ones in the 60s. The main problem once Fender moved into the CBS era was quality control.
5) Fender transitioned to the oversized CBS headstock on all models by the end of 1967.
6) I believe that matching headstocks are pretty rare once you get into the mid 70s... early 70s they might still show up on custom colors.
7) Fender also switched to block inlaid, bound necks on the Jazzmaster and Jaguar by the end of 1967. Your chances of finding an original, early 70s neck without block inlays is basically 0.

_______

1) There are pre CBS Fenders that aren't as good as other pre CBS Fenders out there. I don't think the fact that the decade ticked over magically made the guitars automatically horrible. I think that since Fender had known QC lapses by that time, though, it would be wise to play any guitar before buying, rather than buying sight unseen.
2) They do have large headstocks. The CBS headstock was fully in production by the early 70s on all Jazzies (among others).
3) Kind of seems like it probably doesn't exist with these exact specifications, no. You'd have to be willing to concede on a few of them, or order a custom guitar.
4) Some people swear they do, others swear it's completely subjective. I think there are a lot of great modern guitars. You could easily argue that Fender is currently producing the highest quality guitars these days than it ever could in the 60s. IMO, the main reasons to want a vintage guitar are for "cool factor" and intangibles. I don't think you should go into the market trying to find a vintage guitar specifically because it's old. I just went through this myself. If you fell in love with one, that's one thing... but you're not necessarily going to find your dream guitar just because it's old and Olympic White, you know?

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Pacafeliz
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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by Pacafeliz » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:08 am

I used to own this guitar and it was an incredibly good feeling and sounding guitar!
Fender Jazzmaster 1973 Blond https://reverb.com/item/36371411-fender ... t=36371411
i love delay SO much ...that i procrastinate all the time.

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Mondaysoutar
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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by Mondaysoutar » Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:51 am

Pacafeliz wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:08 am
I used to own this guitar and it was an incredibly good feeling and sounding guitar!
Fender Jazzmaster 1973 Blond https://reverb.com/item/36371411-fender ... t=36371411
I was positive the tort wasn’t original on this first I looked at it man, such a great looking guard I think.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by FrankRay » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:16 am

Just to add, guitars after may 68 are poly not nitro so they don’t age anywhere near as much. I’ve seen a few battered 70s jags, but suspect they might have been really late guitars made from old bodies. Anyway in general all 70s fenders look more or less pristine and won’t have any checking at all.

They also tend to be heavier and therefore less dynamic. If you can, try to find one around 8lbs or less, but you’ll be really lucky to find one that light.

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adamrobertt
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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by adamrobertt » Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:12 am

I mean, any guitar that's 40 years old is going to show wear, regardless of what it's finished with. Also I highly dispute your "heavier = less dynamic" claim... also I'm not sure if it's entirely accurate to say that all post 68 Fenders are automatically boat anchors...

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by gishuk » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:18 am

I've had this guitar for a few months now, its a 1973.

Image

And to try and answer your questions

1) Do early 70's models sound and feel inferior to other eras? In my opinion based on this guitar vs my two 1961 and 1962 Jazzmasters, defiantly does not sound inferior. The pickups are a bit more powerful to my ear, and it has a different tone but not inferior, just different. Poly finish obviously makes it feel different and I'd usually prefer nitro but its not really that big of a difference in feel. I'd say it feels more like a modern Fender than the 60s ones. The weight is also not very different at all between my 60s and 70s JMs.

2) Do early 70's models have enlarged headstocks or am I just "seeing things"? Yeah its bigger.

3) Does this guitar I dream of actually exist (I actually not hung up on year nor value)? Not sure to be honest.

4) Do '60s and '70s JMs sound significantly better than 80's, 90's, etc. models? I think thats a hard question to answer as theres so many variation between guitars of the same era, and especially now there are so many different models of JMs which will all sound different between them let alone compared to old ones. IMO any modern JM with USA pickups, or any of the aftermarket ones is going to sound no worse than a vintage set. But it all depends what your taste is to which would be 'better'

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by simonhpieman » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:48 am

I played a LOT of CBS era Jazzmasters and Jags.

I played a nice 1970 Jag that I wanted to buy but was beaten to by Paul McCartney's son. Grrr.

I played a pair of 68s, one JM, one Jag. Both were really underwhelming and soulless. Both poly, for what it's worth.

I owned a 73 Jazzmaster. I liked it, it sounded good.

There are (I'd say were but they've been there forever so I'll assume they're still there) a pair of Jags at New Kings Road guitars, a 66 and 67. Both nitro. The 67 sounded better but both were nice enough.

The BEST CBS JM I've played was a 67. Still nitro. I tried it out and bonded with it immediately, it sounded SO good and played like I'd had it years. Sadly the eBay auction went a bit too high for me.

I also had an early 65 Jag until recently. It was nice and it sounded good on record but I never truly loved it, though I couldn't tell you why. Certainly not up there with that amazing 67 JM, though I realize that's like comparing chalk and cheese.

Have played some others but these are the ones I remember!

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by Gavanti » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:18 am

I have a ‘73 refinished JM with non-original pickups. I haven’t had the opportunity to play other CBS JM’s but a few pre-CBS. I have had more experience with CBS Jags. What I can say about the ‘73 is that it’s a well-built guitar that sounds very good. It’s not particularly light, more like what I’d expect from a Jag, but that hasn’t really bothered me. The neck is pretty chunky and very comfortable. The block inlays on these are nice, somewhat shinier than the 60s ones. I wouldn’t rule a 70s JM out, but they’re not super easy to find, and I think the custom colors were really limited. Asking price has gone up on these a lot. I’m not certain what they’re actually selling for.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by Ruttiger » Wed Feb 24, 2021 5:27 pm

I have a 1973 Jazzmaster that I purchased several years ago, and really really like-I had an upgraded MIJ Jazzmaster for quite a while before that. The 73 sounds really good, both clean and distorted - it was a sonic improvement over my MIJ, although I really enjoyed that guitar, and it was a very reliable great instrument.

The 73's neck is thicker than my MIJ was, particularly closer towards the body, and is extremely easy to get around on, stays in tune, and I have never had to adjust the action/intonation/truss rod. It does have the oversized headstock. My guitar shows a good deal of age, it clearly has seen some use. It is also actually surprisingly light, compared to 70s strats I have played, especially late 70s strats. It weighs probably the same as my MIJ Jazzmaster did.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by mcatano » Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:48 am

I have a 1980 JM neck on a parts build that has the big headstock, dot inlays, and no binding, so theoretically you could look for an 80/82 JM which is probably the rarest of rare birds. Though if you don't care about binding there are dots+binding 65/66 guitars out there with matched CBS-size headstocks.

Based on the original post, it sounds very much like you want a mish mash of all the different eras of jazzmasters, so maybe a high-quality parts/custom build is a better way to get you where you want to go?

Two pals I've played with a bunch have CBS-era JMs and both prefer the sound of pre-CBS, antiquity 1s or other black-bobbin-ish pickups to the grey bobbin fenders. I honestly don't think it matters too much once you start stepping on pedals, but if you're primarily a clean player or you like a warmer/darker sound then you may not be happy with the brighter sound of the surf-era JMs. And if you're spending $8K on a custom colour JM the last thing you're going to want to do is start swapping pots and pickups out to tame the high end.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by nonemoreblack » Thu Feb 25, 2021 9:33 am

mcatano wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:48 am
I have a 1980 JM neck on a parts build that has the big headstock, dot inlays, and no binding, so theoretically you could look for an 80/82 JM which is probably the rarest of rare birds. Though if you don't care about binding there are dots+binding 65/66 guitars out there with matched CBS-size headstocks.
Do you have any pics of this neck? I’ve always been fascinated by end-run jazzmasters but it seems like there’s barely any pics online.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by Pacafeliz » Thu Feb 25, 2021 10:37 am

I've also owned a 1978/79 Jazzmaster and it was damn fine... And only about half as heavy as the mid 70s Jaguar :wtf:
i love delay SO much ...that i procrastinate all the time.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by gishuk » Thu Feb 25, 2021 10:46 am

I wonder if with these being Fenders top of the line guitars (well I guess the Starcaster was the actual top during the mid/late 70s) that they didn't select the lighter woods for them?
Seems to be a consensus that teles and strats from this period are usually quite a bit heavier than the 60s ones, doesn't seem to be the case for offsets.

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Re: Early 70's Jazzmasters

Post by mcatano » Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:51 pm

nonemoreblack wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 9:33 am
mcatano wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 5:48 am
I have a 1980 JM neck on a parts build that has the big headstock, dot inlays, and no binding, so theoretically you could look for an 80/82 JM which is probably the rarest of rare birds. Though if you don't care about binding there are dots+binding 65/66 guitars out there with matched CBS-size headstocks.
Do you have any pics of this neck? I’ve always been fascinated by end-run jazzmasters but it seems like there’s barely any pics online.
Image

Conveniently, it was sitting right next to me - apologies for the dirty floor and blown out photo.
The neck is stamped 1980, the body is a 65/66, the pickguard/pickups/tailpiece are pat pend era.

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