Pickup height: tubing vs. springs

[clik]

Just bought a Vintera Mustang and I want to raise the bridge pickup a smidge. But it seems "topped out."

I assume there is tubing under the pickguard. If I change the tubing to old school springs, will it let me go higher?

[GilmourD]

Just bought a Vintera Mustang and I want to raise the bridge pickup a smidge. But it seems "topped out."

I assume there is tubing under the pickguard. If I change the tubing to old school springs, will it let me go higher?

Possibly, yes, but my experience has always been that I've replaced springs with tubing to get rid of microphonic issues. You could always carefully trim the tubing.

[clik]

It is weird to me how much hate there is for springs in the Fender world. Whereas humbuckers are invariably installed with springs -- at least, I've never seen one done otherwise, either in real life, pictures, or videos.

[GilmourD]

It is weird to me how much hate there is for springs in the Fender world. Whereas humbuckers are invariably installed with springs -- at least, I've never seen one done otherwise, either in real life, pictures, or videos.

I think the thing with humbucker springs is that they're longer and higher tension in general.

[timtam]

Fender's means of adjusting many pickups' height is "agricultural" to say the least. You'd think it might have been improved since the 1950s. On all my Fender guitars with foam/wood screws, I eventually get around to installing something more effective, usually (internally-threaded) M3 rivet nuts drilled/glued in the cavity floor, with M3 humbucker screws/springs.

[GilmourD]

Fender's means of adjusting many pickups' height is "agricultural" to say the least. You'd think it might have been improved since the 1950s. On all my Fender guitars with foam/wood screws, I eventually get around to installing something more effective, usually (internally-threaded) M3 rivet nuts drilled/glued in the cavity floor, with M3 humbucker screws/springs.

I'm not too bothered by the straight-in-wood installation on a guitar that is basically going to get a set of pickups and then be passed onto my grandkids with those pickups when I finally go to the great guitar store in the sky...

BUT I have been toying with the idea of 3D printing a cushion made out of TPU, testing different internal shapes and infill settings. TPU is the same stuff that phone cases are made out of and ideally won't permanently compress or degrade like the foam we've been using. I've made some door stops out of the stuff and it's pretty tough but if you print it using the right shapes and geometry it can be varying degrees of squishy, too.

[Matthias]

Fender's means of adjusting many pickups' height is "agricultural" to say the least. You'd think it might have been improved since the 1950s. On all my Fender guitars with foam/wood screws, I eventually get around to installing something more effective, usually (internally-threaded) M3 rivet nuts drilled/glued in the cavity floor, with M3 humbucker screws/springs.

I'm not too bothered by the straight-in-wood installation on a guitar that is basically going to get a set of pickups and then be passed onto my grandkids with those pickups when I finally go to the great guitar store in the sky...

BUT I have been toying with the idea of 3D printing a cushion made out of TPU, testing different internal shapes and infill settings. TPU is the same stuff that phone cases are made out of and ideally won't permanently compress or degrade like the foam we've been using. I've made some door stops out of the stuff and it's pretty tough but if you print it using the right shapes and geometry it can be varying degrees of squishy, too.

The foam with springs, like these for basses, seem a good compromise for better security without mods: https://www.stewmac.com/electronics/pic ... l-springs/ I wonder if you can incorporate springs into the TPU?

[timtam]

The foam with springs, like these for basses, seem a good compromise for better security without mods: https://www.stewmac.com/electronics/pic ... l-springs/ I wonder if you can incorporate springs into the TPU?

Foam with embedded springs is also available from aliexpress ...
https://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale- ... .search.0x

I was reading something about pickup height adjustment the other day from one of the big pickup manufacturers. It basically said on jazzmasters and jaguars don't do it unless you really have to, because the wood screws/foam just aren't made for regular adjustments.

When the existing solution doesn't do what it's supposed to, I think it's best to consider changing it. Which is why I think the rivet nuts are a whole better idea. I find I am much more willing to adjust pickup height on guitars with robust height adjustment systems than those with wood screws/foam. With the wood screws I'm always worried the hole will get stripped, along with the foam not always pushing very well.

[Matthias]

The foam with springs, like these for basses, seem a good compromise for better security without mods: https://www.stewmac.com/electronics/pic ... l-springs/ I wonder if you can incorporate springs into the TPU?

Foam with embedded springs is also available from aliexpress ...
https://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale- ... .search.0x

I was reading something about pickup height adjustment the other day from one of the big pickup manufacturers. It basically said on jazzmasters and jaguars don't do it unless you really have to, because the wood screws/foam just aren't made for regular adjustments.

When the existing solution doesn't do what it's supposed to, I think it's best to consider changing it. Which is why I think the rivet nuts are a whole better idea. I find I am much more willing to adjust pickup height on guitars with robust height adjustment systems than those with wood screws/foam. With the wood screws I'm always worried the hole will get stripped, along with the foam not always pushing very well.

100%. I imagine enlarging the screw holes and recessing a nut then switching to Strat/HB type bolts is a simple way. I’m now wondering if there’s a fully reversible mod for this but I’m not picturing one.

[GilmourD]

Fender's means of adjusting many pickups' height is "agricultural" to say the least. You'd think it might have been improved since the 1950s. On all my Fender guitars with foam/wood screws, I eventually get around to installing something more effective, usually (internally-threaded) M3 rivet nuts drilled/glued in the cavity floor, with M3 humbucker screws/springs.

I'm not too bothered by the straight-in-wood installation on a guitar that is basically going to get a set of pickups and then be passed onto my grandkids with those pickups when I finally go to the great guitar store in the sky...

BUT I have been toying with the idea of 3D printing a cushion made out of TPU, testing different internal shapes and infill settings. TPU is the same stuff that phone cases are made out of and ideally won't permanently compress or degrade like the foam we've been using. I've made some door stops out of the stuff and it's pretty tough but if you print it using the right shapes and geometry it can be varying degrees of squishy, too.

The foam with springs, like these for basses, seem a good compromise for better security without mods: https://www.stewmac.com/electronics/pic ... l-springs/ I wonder if you can incorporate springs into the TPU?

You know, I actually had to remove that stuff from one of my Jazzmasters last night because it was interfering with the connector on the EMGs I installed and I couldn't get them low enough. LOL

As far as the TPU... The TPU could be the spring! TPU is what your phone case is likely made out of, so you probably know that different densities of it will have different stiffnesses. You can make it a solid, hard block or a squishy shape. I made some doorstops out of some bright orange TPU and [incoming 3D printer nerd shiz] printed it with 4 layers of walls and 15% gyroid infill. They're sturdy but squishy in the right ways. What I'd probably do for a height foam replacement is print it with only two walls and a lower density infill (gyroid is fun because it'll flex in all directions with TPU) and I could put a solid coil spring shape somewhere in it. The only reason I haven't done this already is that non-fun stuff has been keeping me really busy.

[GilmourD]

The foam with springs, like these for basses, seem a good compromise for better security without mods: https://www.stewmac.com/electronics/pic ... l-springs/ I wonder if you can incorporate springs into the TPU?

Foam with embedded springs is also available from aliexpress ...
https://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale- ... .search.0x

I was reading something about pickup height adjustment the other day from one of the big pickup manufacturers. It basically said on jazzmasters and jaguars don't do it unless you really have to, because the wood screws/foam just aren't made for regular adjustments.

When the existing solution doesn't do what it's supposed to, I think it's best to consider changing it. Which is why I think the rivet nuts are a whole better idea. I find I am much more willing to adjust pickup height on guitars with robust height adjustment systems than those with wood screws/foam. With the wood screws I'm always worried the hole will get stripped, along with the foam not always pushing very well.

I've got this in one of my Jaguars.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009188G2G

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00270ZSIU

[timtam]

....
100%. I imagine enlarging the screw holes and recessing a nut then switching to Strat/HB type bolts is a simple way. I’m now wondering if there’s a fully reversible mod for this but I’m not picturing one.

One thing I've been meaning to try is glueing the rim of the M3 rivet nut upside down to the cavity floor. So the threads are all above the floor. It would require shorter HB screws. But that might make it a reversible mod, as the original screw holes would be preserved.

[Matthias]

....
100%. I imagine enlarging the screw holes and recessing a nut then switching to Strat/HB type bolts is a simple way. I’m now wondering if there’s a fully reversible mod for this but I’m not picturing one.

One thing I've been meaning to try is glueing the rim of the M3 rivet nut upside down to the cavity floor. So the threads are all above the floor. It would require shorter HB screws. But that might make it a reversible mod, as the original screw holes would be preserved.

I guess it would be possible to print a thin housing for the rivet nuts in PLA, glue the nuts into that then screw the housing to the cavity. I guess if this was a manufactured solution it would look like a metal cavity shielding plate with threaded holes. I guess for vintage-style shielding plates, bushings under the plates would be best.