Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

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Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by gibs » Mon Jun 21, 2021 2:56 pm

Hey guys, been gone for a long time, been getting the itch to make a build and was wondering about the differences in vibrato tailpieces from different origins. Specifically any that have the trem lock button, and the collet for the vibrato arm. All I remember is that some of the early Mexican made classic player series had threaded arms like a strat, and that AVRI were just push in but that sometimes something would wear out to where the arm would no longer stay in place. Then of course there’s the Staytrem collet which seems the best option. Basically I want to get a vibrato that’s going to hold the arm in place and not drop down against the cable when released, but hoping to avoid ordering something from Europe like the Staytrem if possible. Open to any suggestions for diy mods.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by Mondaysoutar » Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:05 pm

The AVRI unit is held in high regard, the hammer trick should sort any sloppiness that develops in the arm man. I changed to Staytrem which works better for me, a wee bit more reaction in the arm as it feels tighter or something.

Anyway, I’d say AVRI unit, YouTube the hammer trick and you’ll be sorted man.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by HarlowTheFish » Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:26 pm

AVRI and AmPro are the same unit, but AmPro has a screw-in arm and collet.
Classic Player/Player/Whatever they're calling it is like an import AmPro, HNB seems to like these and they're not crazy pricey.
Anything cheaper you should probably just avoid because you're gonna spend a bunch of time trying to get it up to spec.
There's also the new Panorama unit which seems great, but you can't get them anywhere outside of an AmPro II guitar, so unless it becomes available between now and when you need to order one, I'd say just go with an AVRI or AmPro depending on which collet you prefer -- my AVRI only ran me like $20 more than a Classic Player, so you're not even saving that much.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by adamrobertt » Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:46 pm

IMO the newest production AVRI units don't need the "hammer trick" or any kind of intervention. In 2012 they redesigned the arm and collet and it stays tight for a long time now.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by HarlowTheFish » Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:36 am

adamrobertt wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:46 pm
IMO the newest production AVRI units don't need the "hammer trick" or any kind of intervention. In 2012 they redesigned the arm and collet and it stays tight for a long time now.
Yeah, mine is super solid -- sits in place very well, but isn't super tight to move when I want it to and not noisy/scratchy

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by Mondaysoutar » Tue Jun 22, 2021 2:52 pm

HarlowTheFish wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:36 am
adamrobertt wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:46 pm
IMO the newest production AVRI units don't need the "hammer trick" or any kind of intervention. In 2012 they redesigned the arm and collet and it stays tight for a long time now.
Yeah, mine is super solid -- sits in place very well, but isn't super tight to move when I want it to and not noisy/scratchy

Have to say, with my AO JM, the arm became slightly loose after a year or so of pretty heavy useage man. Don’t get me wrong, I only went to Staytrem arm and collet as I was happy with the bridge so thought at 30 odd sheets, it was worth exploring.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by HNB » Tue Jun 22, 2021 3:31 pm

HarlowTheFish wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 5:26 pm
AVRI and AmPro are the same unit, but AmPro has a screw-in arm and collet.
Classic Player/Player/Whatever they're calling it is like an import AmPro, HNB seems to like these and they're not crazy pricey.
Anything cheaper you should probably just avoid because you're gonna spend a bunch of time trying to get it up to spec.
There's also the new Panorama unit which seems great, but you can't get them anywhere outside of an AmPro II guitar, so unless it becomes available between now and when you need to order one, I'd say just go with an AVRI or AmPro depending on which collet you prefer -- my AVRI only ran me like $20 more than a Classic Player, so you're not even saving that much.
I like the classic player tremolos when I am not using mastery ones. I could buy an avri and put the ampro collet on it, but the ampro and classic player have the same threaded arm and collet. Classic players tend to be cheaper than avri ones. :)
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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by gibs » Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:47 pm

So then the am pro and classic player are threaded (possibly the same?) do they both have metric thread collets, or is the am pro 3/8” like the AVRI?

Side note, investigating bridges, any others that have the narrow E to E spacing (52mm) besides the ampro and Staytrem? Thought I read a thread that said this one below was narrow but can’t find anything for sure, also like that the saddle hieght is adjustable, as I’m not positive that I’m going for a 9-1/2” radius at this point.

https://darrenriley.com/store/fender-mu ... 081239049/

Also thought I read that some of the newer squire bridges have narrower spacing as well, but no one seemed 100% positive on that.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by HNB » Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:50 pm

They are threaded the same. I have used ampro arms on classic player tremolos. I doubt they are metric, but I don’t know the size. I just know from using them that they are the same size threaded arms and collets. :)
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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by gibs » Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:59 pm

HNB wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:50 pm
They are threaded the same. I have used ampro arms on classic player tremolos. I doubt they are metric, but I don’t know the size. I just know from using them that they are the same size threaded arms and collets. :)
Good to know, was also wondering if the outside thread that screws into the vibrato plate was the same on the two. Is it the am pro unit that supposedly has heavier trem action like a strat?

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by HNB » Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:21 pm

I haven't ever used an ampro tremolo. I do know trying to get the collet off a classic player tremolo is a huge pain in the ass. Those are on really tight.
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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by timtam » Tue Jun 22, 2021 11:06 pm

gibs wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:47 pm
So then the am pro and classic player are threaded (possibly the same?) do they both have metric thread collets, or is the am pro 3/8” like the AVRI?

Side note, investigating bridges, any others that have the narrow E to E spacing (52mm) besides the ampro and Staytrem? Thought I read a thread that said this one below was narrow but can’t find anything for sure, also like that the saddle hieght is adjustable, as I’m not positive that I’m going for a 9-1/2” radius at this point.

https://darrenriley.com/store/fender-mu ... 081239049/

Also thought I read that some of the newer squire bridges have narrower spacing as well, but no one seemed 100% positive on that.
According to Staytrem, MIM guitars' trems can come with either 3/8" (like MIA) or 10mm outer threads on the collets ...
https://staytrem.com/epages/950002362.s ... tion_guide

The 0081239049 bridge you linked (with height-adjustable saddles) has 55-56mm E-E spacing.

52mm spacing is on the later generation Am Pro bridge (also used in the Ultra) at 9.5" radius (early ones were 56mm). IIRC the latest CV bridges are reportedly 52mm ?? (also 9.5" radius). Staytrem is 52mm (either 9.5" or 7.25" radius). The (later generation) Marr jag bridge is 52mm (7.25") but harder to find aftermarket now.
"I just knew I wanted to make a sound that was the complete opposite of a Les Paul, and that’s pretty much a Jaguar." Rowland S. Howard.

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by gibs » Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:59 am

timtam wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 11:06 pm
gibs wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:47 pm
So then the am pro and classic player are threaded (possibly the same?) do they both have metric thread collets, or is the am pro 3/8” like the AVRI?

Side note, investigating bridges, any others that have the narrow E to E spacing (52mm) besides the ampro and Staytrem? Thought I read a thread that said this one below was narrow but can’t find anything for sure, also like that the saddle hieght is adjustable, as I’m not positive that I’m going for a 9-1/2” radius at this point.

https://darrenriley.com/store/fender-mu ... 081239049/

Also thought I read that some of the newer squire bridges have narrower spacing as well, but no one seemed 100% positive on that.
According to Staytrem, MIM guitars' trems can come with either 3/8" (like MIA) or 10mm outer threads on the collets ...
https://staytrem.com/epages/950002362.s ... tion_guide

The 0081239049 bridge you linked (with height-adjustable saddles) has 55-56mm E-E spacing.

52mm spacing is on the later generation Am Pro bridge (also used in the Ultra) at 9.5" radius (early ones were 56mm). IIRC the latest CV bridges are reportedly 52mm ?? (also 9.5" radius). Staytrem is 52mm (either 9.5" or 7.25" radius). The (later generation) Marr jag bridge is 52mm (7.25") but harder to find aftermarket now.
So none of the narrow spaces bridges have adjustable saddles?

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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by timtam » Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:19 am

gibs wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:59 am
timtam wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 11:06 pm
gibs wrote:
Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:47 pm
So then the am pro and classic player are threaded (possibly the same?) do they both have metric thread collets, or is the am pro 3/8” like the AVRI?

Side note, investigating bridges, any others that have the narrow E to E spacing (52mm) besides the ampro and Staytrem? Thought I read a thread that said this one below was narrow but can’t find anything for sure, also like that the saddle hieght is adjustable, as I’m not positive that I’m going for a 9-1/2” radius at this point.

https://darrenriley.com/store/fender-mu ... 081239049/

Also thought I read that some of the newer squire bridges have narrower spacing as well, but no one seemed 100% positive on that.
According to Staytrem, MIM guitars' trems can come with either 3/8" (like MIA) or 10mm outer threads on the collets ...
https://staytrem.com/epages/950002362.s ... tion_guide

The 0081239049 bridge you linked (with height-adjustable saddles) has 55-56mm E-E spacing.

52mm spacing is on the later generation Am Pro bridge (also used in the Ultra) at 9.5" radius (early ones were 56mm). IIRC the latest CV bridges are reportedly 52mm ?? (also 9.5" radius). Staytrem is 52mm (either 9.5" or 7.25" radius). The (later generation) Marr jag bridge is 52mm (7.25") but harder to find aftermarket now.
So none of the narrow spaces bridges have adjustable saddles?
AFAIK that is correct. EDIT: Amongst adjustable saddle bridges there is also the Warmoth Modified Mustang bridge, but it is 55-56mm E-E. It is distinguishable from the Fender 0081239049 bridge by the ridges on each end of the barrels, which are also larger.
https://warmoth.com/index.php/modified-mustang-bridge
Similar to this one:
https://www.customworldguitarparts.com/ ... ddles.html

There are many inexpensive bridges similar to the 0081239049 style on ebay from China, and so it's theoretically possible that one might have narrower spacing. But I've never seen one that claimed that.

Of course the vintage-style threaded-barrel bridge is adjustable and you have reasonable control over string spacing by virtue of the threaded string grooves.
Last edited by timtam on Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Differences in tailpieces/ vibrato arms for jazzmaster

Post by jorri » Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:52 am

Ive used one of those super cheap chinese bridges and whilst they hold up surprisingly well despite inferior metal and the cost of a pack of strings they are the wider spacing...assuming they are all the same.

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