Mastery Cyclic Pickups?

[DeathJag]

Magnetic transduction in a high-impedance environment is a crude technology that contains many parasitic behaviors.

In addition to being a transducer (voltage source), the pickup's coil is also an inductor (it's a coil of wire!), a resistor (thousands of turns of skinny gauge wire make a literal "wirewound resistor"), and a capacitor (thousands of feet of insulated conductor laid right next to each other will have considerable capacitance).

This inductance, resistance and capacitance all work to determine the bandwidth and resonant peak(s) of the pickup.

But in addition, there are other resistors and capacitors in the circuit--both actual components and parasitics. Here are a few:

• The volume pot is a resistor in parallel with the pickup's own resistance
• The tone control is a resistor and capacitor in series, and that network is in parallel with the pickup's own resistance and inductance
• The input impedance of the amp behaves like a resistance in parallel with the pickup's own resistance and inductance
• The instrument cable is a resistor in series with the pickup's resistance and inductance, and a capacitor in parallel with the pickup's capacitance
• If the guitar has a so-called "treble bleed" (should be called "treble pass") network, this is an additional capacitance (and sometimes also resistance) in parallel with the volume control's resistance (when it's turned down), which is itself in parallel with the resistance and capacitance of the pickup

This is poetry, great post!

[Larry Mal]

It was alluded to above, but microphones all have frequency response plots (many even include an individual plot with each microphone sold), but literally no good recording engineer uses this information to inform their selection of microphones when doing actual work.

That was me, and no, you won't be consulting any chart when you decide on what microphone to use.

However, you might look at the chart when deciding what you might want to purchase, because you can take a look at it and see what the microphone maker is going for, anyway.

Comparing the frequency response of the KM184 and KM84 can show you that Neumann was going for a more highly detailed and hyped high end, for instance:

http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Neumann/KM-184

Which they absolutely got. Now, I know you and most other people greatly prefer the 84 to the 184 (I own two 184 and have limited experience with the 84s but I do not love the 184), and I know that no one would make a decision to use one or the other based on the plot graph, still by looking at those graphs you can at least learn something.

And personally, I would love it if guitar pickup makers would offer up the same information. You mention a lot of variables down the chain, and that's all true, of course. But that's true with microphones as well and the plot points are still of some use with those, and I think they would be even more useful for guitar pickups.

For instance, I have learned that I like the more detailed high end of the Gibson Memphis Historic Spec humbuckers as opposed to the Burstbucker 3 pickups or something, still I think it could have been helpful to be able to compare the frequency output of the pickups.

Maybe most people don't feel they need that, but it's a little hard to say, because the guitar industry seems to be adamant that customers not get it. Like I say, it seems like guitar makers are happier to sell based on nostalgia or marketing terms rather than specs.

Who am I to argue? No one seems to be clamoring for more information or anything.

The only reason I mention this is because the lack of information that is endemic to the guitar industry has really reached its conclusion with these Mastery pickups, a whole new design, and yet they don't seem to think that the market for these pickups wants or cares or needs for any information at all about them. It's made by Mastery, it's five hundred bucks, that seems to be all they think they will need in order to sell these pickups to their target market.

And they are probably correct.

[Embenny]

Yep, Brad summed it up very nicely.

The thing pickup makers really don't want players to know is that swapping out a volume pot, a cap, or a patch cord will change your tone as - or more - significantly than changing from their "blonde beauty formvar" wind to their "timeless classic plain enamel" wind, or whatever silly names they give their pickups.

And I totally agree with Brad's statement that most pickup winders could mislabel and ship the wrong model to people and make them equally satisfied, because all well-made pickups with reasonable specs really do sound good.

I really don't think that even gear-obsessed guitarists could tell what basic category of guitar or pickup is being used in a final mix, let alone tell a Telecaster with A3 and Broadcaster wind and tone knob at 8 from a Les Paul Jr with A5 and a 60's wind and its tone knob wide open when run through a random assortment of pedals and amps and placed in a full mix.

[Larry Mal]

And I totally agree with Brad's statement that most pickup winders could mislabel and ship the wrong model to people and make them equally satisfied, because all well-made pickups with reasonable specs really do sound good.

I really don't think that even gear-obsessed guitarists could tell what basic category of guitar or pickup is being used in a final mix, let alone tell a Telecaster with A3 and Broadcaster wind and tone knob at 8 from a Les Paul Jr with A5 and a 60's wind and its tone knob wide open when run through a random assortment of pedals and amps and placed in a full mix.

Right. I mean, here I am splitting hairs on a guitar forum, and I know a lot of the specs and details, and even I don't care much about any of it. I put in some Alnico 2 pickups in my Telecaster on a lark, they sound good, and that's the end of what I think about it. I don't feel that all my guitars have to have Alnico 2 or anything.

And as has been mentioned, my pick attack changes the tone more than the difference between Alnico 2 and 5 anyway.

[øøøøøøø]

Zooming out for a sec, we really are spoiled for choice in 2022.

It didn't used to be this way, and it may not be this way forever, but right now finding a very good sounding magnetic guitar pickup is trivially easy.

Full disclosure, I do have an artist relationship with Lollar (but this is my honest opinion): All of their models are better than anything I remember being available when I started playing in the 90s. There are other great manufacturers, too, for whom this is also true.

Guitar players have gotten more obsessive as our pool of options has increased, but 20 years ago we'd almost certainly have been thrilled with most of the stuff we can get now.

70 years ago guitar players were thrilled with whatever Gibson and Fender made, because there were no other options.

[Larry Mal]

No doubt. It's boom time for guitar pickups, and while there are some industry leaders like Lollar out there that make great pickups, there are a lot of other pickup makers that also have excellent products at lower price points. I am thinking of Q Pickups on Reverb, and a few others.

And there's also some Mastery bullshit.

[Fiddy]

Sound samples are needed, not descriptions.

This is x pickup, being played through a PR RI.

This is the same x pickup being played through a JCM800 etc...

You get the idea...

[hulakatt]

They also didn't respond to my email. It's possible I'm shunted directly to trash, though.

Maybe someone else should email them?

[DerKastellan]

Yep, Brad summed it up very nicely.

The thing pickup makers really don't want players to know is that swapping out a volume pot, a cap, or a patch cord will change your tone as - or more - significantly than changing from their "blonde beauty formvar" wind to their "timeless classic plain enamel" wind, or whatever silly names they give their pickups.

I shall give that statement definitely a try. I know how good my old budget strat sounded when wiring in a Mojotone wiring harness, so i guess I'll try swapping more parts in my cheaper guitars as well...

[Embenny]

Yep, Brad summed it up very nicely.

The thing pickup makers really don't want players to know is that swapping out a volume pot, a cap, or a patch cord will change your tone as - or more - significantly than changing from their "blonde beauty formvar" wind to their "timeless classic plain enamel" wind, or whatever silly names they give their pickups.

I shall give that statement definitely a try. I know how good my old budget strat sounded when wiring in a Mojotone wiring harness, so i guess I'll try swapping more parts in my cheaper guitars as well...

It's not necessarily about swapping out cheap components for more expensive ones, but rather understanding what goal you're trying to accomplish.

For example, the main tonal effect of winding a pickup hotter is lowering the resonant frequency and flattening it a bit.

Now that we have ample availability of boosts and such, raw output is rarely ever needed. So when someone swaps out a lower output pickup for a slight overwind and loves the overdrive tones more, it's not necessarily because the new pickup is magic or the small output boost was exactly what they needed. Swapping some component values (lower R pots, or a higher C patchcord) would likely have accomplished a similar, but not identical, end goal.

It's why Jimi Hendrix used curly cables in the studio sometimes, for overdriven tones. Bill Lawrence wrote a little article with the math to show that the capacitance of those cables lowers a vintage strat pickup's resonant frequency into the range of a PAF, which many people find preferable for overdrive tones.

There's a lot of manipulation that can be done with inexpensive electronics (caps, resistors, etc) to nudge a pickup in one direction or another. You'll never make a lipstick tube sound like a Super Distortion, but a lot of pickup swaps are done for much subtler changes than that (e.g. picking a similar wind with A2 vs A5 because they're looking for rounding out or accentuating the treble, respectively).

[JSett]

Zooming out for a sec, we really are spoiled for choice in 2022.

It didn't used to be this way, and it may not be this way forever, but right now finding a very good sounding magnetic guitar pickup is trivially easy.

Full disclosure, I do have an artist relationship with Lollar (but this is my honest opinion): All of their models are better than anything I remember being available when I started playing in the 90s. There are other great manufacturers, too, for whom this is also true.

Guitar players have gotten more obsessive as our pool of options has increased, but 20 years ago we'd almost certainly have been thrilled with most of the stuff we can get now.

70 years ago guitar players were thrilled with whatever Gibson and Fender made, because there were no other options.

This is a great point. When I first got into it (90's as well), getting a hold of a replacement unit for your guitar, or a decent Super Distortion or rails pickup, wasn't always that easy, or cheap. Having too many options 100% makes us all spoilt a little.

I'm sure all of us that have played offsets for 15+ years can remember the joy of getting your hands on a Mustang bridge. That was our only upgrade option. And we were grateful for it when we could as they weren't widely available as a spare part either for a long time. Then Staytrem and Mastery came along and it was like Christmas! Now people can't help but moan about those options and find little faults with them. It's sad really as we've got it made these days.

I don't know why Mastery seem to be such dicks these days though. I like their product and have used their bridges for 12(?) years but being aloof and pissing off your market - especially now there's so many alternatives - seems silly.

[Deed_Poll]

Perhaps I shouldn't be saying this here, but if John @ Mastery didn't treat me like hot garbage three or so years ago, I would not be designing and manufacturing my own bridge. We'll see how things go, but I'm hoping it will be his loss! I still think his vibrato is the best in the business, not a fan of what his bridge is trying to do (fixed posts / low friction) but I think if that's what you're after, it's a really nicely machined piece. Like others, I don't see the point in these pickups, other than perhaps mounting two sets to make a full circle that can be rotated? Anyway, it's his prerogative to make what he wants and charge what he wants.

[hulakatt]

What is it about people who machine nice hardware being arrogant pricks? Mastery and Callaham both have that reputation.

At least Glendale is friendly AF.

[Shadoweclipse13]

What is it about people who machine nice hardware being arrogant pricks? Mastery and Callaham both have that reputation.

At least Glendale is friendly AF.

Callaham can definitely be like that. At one point him and another builder or two didn't offer lefty parts, and I made a comment about that on another forum, and he actually got on the forum to call me out about it. Like, if you offer lefty stuff or not, you should be really clear and upfront about whether you do or not.

[øøøøøøø]

Looks like Curtis Novak is actually the one who made these.

He was once a member here, maybe he’d be willing to share more details

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bm6vOJJFuie ... =copy_link