NGD: Guild M-120E...

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PorkyPrimeCut
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:12 am

Dave wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 3:46 am
Gorgeous addition Mark.

I recently picked up the slope shoulder J45 knockoff DS-240 from that line and am incredibly happy with mine too.
There's 2 happy customers then :)

I had a quick look at the specs on the DS-240 (very nice!) & see your tuners are actually Guild-branded. I wonder if they're a step up from mine.
While I'm OK shelling out another 60 Euros for upgraded tuners, I'm clueless as to alternatives to the Grovers I've read about (other than Gotohs, which are even pricier).

How do yours feel? Solid? A little on the light side? Do they hold tune well?
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by Scout » Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:40 am

Why would you immediately remove the fishman? I’ve installed several over the years and done correctly they don’t affect the tone greatly and I’ve found them, earlier ones anyway, to work well on stage and for recording . I would live with it before removing it, if you do you will need a new saddle, not a whole bridge. Enjoy

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:49 am

Scout wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:40 am
Why would you immediately remove the fishman? I’ve installed several over the years and done correctly they don’t affect the tone greatly and I’ve found them, earlier ones anyway, to work well on stage and for recording . I would live with it before removing it, if you do you will need a new saddle, not a whole bridge. Enjoy
I know it's a little bit of a contentious issue but I just want as little as possible inside the guitar. Less chance of anything coming loose & rattling around. I'm not a live player, not at the moment anyway, so it's kind of surplus.

For the record, it's installed very well &, from what I've read, they're decent pickups. I could just as easily sell it to fund the possible tuner upgrade.

Early days though. I'm glued to this thing at the moment & won't make any hasty decisions.

...and, yeah, I meant replacing the saddle, not the entire rosewood base :)
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by Scout » Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:03 am

No worries, I thought I might add a little different perspective, I have found the undersaddle pickup to be an excellent choice and have installed them in everything from’60’s guitars to brand new imports for performers and have good feedback from them.
The good kind of feedback :)

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by Dave » Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:55 am

PorkyPrimeCut wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 4:12 am
Dave wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 3:46 am
Gorgeous addition Mark.

I recently picked up the slope shoulder J45 knockoff DS-240 from that line and am incredibly happy with mine too.
There's 2 happy customers then :)

I had a quick look at the specs on the DS-240 (very nice!) & see your tuners are actually Guild-branded. I wonder if they're a step up from mine.
While I'm OK shelling out another 60 Euros for upgraded tuners, I'm clueless as to alternatives to the Grovers I've read about (other than Gotohs, which are even pricier).

How do yours feel? Solid? A little on the light side? Do they hold tune well?
Image

I know they’re “Guild” branded but just for reference that’s the kind they are, I’d be willing to bet yours uses same ones no?

I find them to tune well and don’t notice slipping or anything goofy with them. I’m not a real connoisseur though, so others may disagree.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by sookwinder » Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:34 am

Mark, looks great.
The first time I played an all mahogany acoustic I heard immediately that 1930s sound. Does yours have that sound?

I am a fanboy of (high quality) manufactured Chinese acoustics. When they are done well they are awesome. But I have found that sometimes in spite of the AAA quality wood work and base materials some manufacturers get costs out of the builds by using cheaper quality tuners. So on my two Chinese acoustics I have replaced the tuners with better quality parts. But then again my resonators that are made in China have (Korean made)Wilkinson brand tuners and they are superb. Do the tuners on the guitar slip?
relaxing alternative to doing actual work ...

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by marqueemoon » Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:52 am

Nice. I love mahogany and smaller bodied acoustics.

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Sun Aug 30, 2020 8:47 am

Dave wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:55 am
...I know they’re “Guild” branded but just for reference that’s the kind they are, I’d be willing to bet yours uses same ones no?

I find them to tune well and don’t notice slipping or anything goofy with them...
The screws that hold the cogs in place on mine are black & they're non-branded. They also feel quite lightweight so I'm guessing they're cheaper versions of the ones yours has. I gather the higher range Guilds have open-backed Grovers.

sookwinder wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:34 am
Mark, looks great.
The first time I played an all mahogany acoustic I heard immediately that 1930s sound. Does yours have that sound?
If you mean that kind of Delta blues era tone, absolutely. I'm not a massive blues fan but would really love to learn some alternative tunings & practice picking more so I can see myself starting on easy blues riffs. Half the reason for buying this was the fact it excels as a finger-picking guitar but I'm pleasantly surprised by how good it sounds as a strummer, even when strummed hard.

sookwinder wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 6:34 am
I am a fanboy of (high quality) manufactured Chinese acoustics. When they are done well they are awesome. But I have found that sometimes in spite of the AAA quality wood work and base materials some manufacturers get costs out of the builds by using cheaper quality tuners. So on my two Chinese acoustics I have replaced the tuners with better quality parts. But then again my resonators that are made in China have (Korean made)Wilkinson brand tuners and they are superb. Do the tuners on the guitar slip?
The guitar needs a mild re-tune after constant playing, particularly if I'm bending a lot or going for it with the strumming. I've read other reviews saying the same. In fact, that seems to be one of the only downsides for some people & an upgrade has totally solved the problem. So, it'll be money well spent.

I actually remember reading one of your threads where you upgraded to better tuners. Really fancy, well made looking things too.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by sookwinder » Sun Aug 30, 2020 10:31 am

Gotoh brand … quite expensive but superb tuners with ebony buttons.
In the end I found a guy/online store in Canada that can get them cheaper than a store in Tokyo.
Gotoh have a good range of acoustic guitar tuners, including those that would suit your guitar.

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:11 am

Yeah, they look amazing!

I looked at Gotoh as an alternative to Grover & saw they're more expensive. I was actually shocked by how pricey some of the other brands are, when you consider how affordable & reliable tuners like closed-back Klusons are.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by Maggieo » Sun Aug 30, 2020 11:13 am

Congrats!!! Guilds are so damn good.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:40 am

Dave wrote:
Sun Aug 30, 2020 5:55 am
I know they’re “Guild” branded but just for reference that’s the kind they are, I’d be willing to bet yours uses same ones no?

I find them to tune well and don’t notice slipping or anything goofy with them. I’m not a real connoisseur though, so others may disagree.
I didn't think to simply compare the number of teeth on your tuners with mine.

Yours are 18:1 and mine are 14:1s.

Interestingly the new line of M-120s have 18:1s too. It's in the specs list & an obvious upgrade to the previous model.
So, I get a hardcase & OK tuners. New customers get a soft case & better tuners.

A dead heat, probably, but I'll take that.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Fri Sep 25, 2020 4:48 am

So, after a few more weeks of constant play it seems the G and B strings do slip ever so slightly out of tune.

I'll take a closer look at the nut & will also re-string the guitar, even though I think it's strung fine at the moment. Blaming the tuners is the last thing I'll do but, even aesthetically, they're starting to grate on me, particularly after studying the tuners on the new M20 (which are actually 20:1, not 18:1 as I'd first thought). I'm really falling for the look of the ivory buttons & feel they suit these models better than the slight bling of the chrome/nickel tuners...

M120...
Image

M20...
Image

So, I did some more digging & have found that Grovers only come in chrome. Schaller, Gotoh & Waverly all do ivory-buttoned tuners but are pretty expensive. Then today I discovered the Kluson Prestige line & see they do a set at a more affordable price (half that of the Waverlys). I've only limited experience with modern Klusons but the "single line" ones a have on another of my guitars are great. Hopefully these work well too...

Image

I'm hoping there won't be a problem with spacing on the headstock. The stock mounting plates are a tight fit & a slightly different shape, plus, these Klusons are a slightly different shape.
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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by pesdispenser » Tue Sep 29, 2020 1:14 am

Lovely guitars, these. I've had mine for 7 years or so and it's definitely my desert island guitar - very comfortable and probably the most playable neck I've experienced

. I've but a bone but/saddle in mine, removed the under-saddle pickup (can never get used to the quackiness of a piezo) and installed a Dearmond Tone Boss (which I rarely use anyway).

In the future I will definitely consider some ebony bridge pins... Any advice on sizes for these? Is it a one size fits all thing?

Mainly keep mine in DADGAD and strung with 12s for some fingerpicking goodness - I feel like they can do strumming just fine, but not as well as a Dread.

Congrats and enjoy!

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Re: NGD: Guild M-120E...

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Tue Sep 29, 2020 4:14 am

I'm not particularly fussed about the installed pickup so I may remove it too. One of these days I'll buy a similar pickup to yours (I was thinking something by LR Baggs) which I could use on both my acoustics.

Where did you get the replacement bone saddle & did you have to resize it at all?

I got identical bridge pins to my Guild D50, knowing they use the same size pins on all their acoustics. These are the ones.

LENGTH = 30mm COLLAR DIAMETER = 5.3mm END TAPER DIAMETER = 4.5mm
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