NGD

[Fiddy]

I just got a Squier Jazzmaster 70s RI. The fret rocker test also came back positive. There are a few uneven frets.

I just bought some decent fretting tools, so I'll do so minor leveling, crowning and polishing but just like yours probably the average player wouldn't notice.

The action is low but I feel I can make it just a bit lower.

But yeah, really liking this guitar you got.

[GGJaguar]

A beauty, congrats! I've been trying to resist buying one of these, but I may succumb. I think they got it right this time around. Enjoy your new Epi!

[seenoevil II]

I will say that my epiphone firebird from 2020 did have a couple high frets and pointy ends. It was covered under warrantee and frankly I could've done them myself, but I liked it so much that I decided to go for the Gibson version. Love the Gibson, but those issues aside, it's really a wash. Kinda goes to what Larry was saying. Aside from the fine details, these guitars are on a part with the USA stuff

[Larry Mal]

The Firebird is a great example of what I'm talking about, for the vast majority of the time Epiphone Firebirds have been distinctly different from the Gibson ones, the Firebird is a very elaborate guitar being not only neck through, but also nine-ply laminate neck through and all that. Not an easy guitar to make cheaply.

So the Epiphone ones were kind of cheap looking set neck guitars with thick and uninspiring finishes.

Then one day the Epiphone Firebirds came out with genuine neck through construction, and even better, with nice Alnico 2 pickups where the Gibsons still had the super hot ceramic things.

And once Gibson dumbed down the headstock and tuner on both versions, and Gibson Firebirds got AlNiCo pickups also, they were roughly the same other than nation of origin.

I don't even really love saying all this, because I'm pretty sure we are at the tail end of American electric guitar manufacturing, and the companies have been priming the market to accept Chinese made stuff for a long time now. Some of you might think that's great, cheaper guitars and all that.

Personally, I still don't, and the only reason I bought this Riviera was, well, it's cool and there is not an American made version I could otherwise buy. Even if there was, though, it would cost over three thousand dollars and I could not afford it.

So this is a mixed bag for me, the guitar is great, the guitar is cheap. I'd recommend it. The ethical consumer in me is very alarmed, however.

But I'll try and keep this focused on the actual guitar. I'll get out my 330 later and get some pictures of them together.

As I play this Riviera more I like it more, I put a capo on it yesterday and it's really great and great sounding with that.

[seenoevil II]

I've played a couple of the post 2020 epiphone thin lines and man are they nice. IDK about this one, but I know that the 335's are split HB's with push pulls.

I have an email thread with Mike, our friend from Canada, and I was referencing a conversation you, he and I had back in the day where you were saying the Epiphone ES-335 was every bit as good as a Gibson, I was skeptical then, but at some point I'm going to bring out my ES-330 and play the Riviera and that side by side.

But mainly I'm going to compare the quality. My feeling right now is, all the things Gibson used to do to hold Epiphones back from being as good as anything else seem to be gone now. The Riviera's headstock is kind of crude and unfinished, I kind of think.

It's always fun to create little "bands" where you track the same two guitars together.

Oh man, those threads. Like so much of my posting history here, I wasn't wrong per se, but it was kind of an unnecessary point. I wanted these profit seeking companies to be boy scouts and deliver high quality in the most efficient way possible to pass the savings on to the hard working musician public. I've since accepted the results of the invisible hand as fine, I guess.

I know what you mean with the little details. I do recall my briefly owned epi MIC firebird having some QC issues in the fine details. Inlays, fret ends, little things. And Gibson sweat the small stuff as part of their raison d'etre. Sometimes I find myself just gazing at the head stock, because, damn if they didn't get it just perfect. The lines the finish (meanwhile, a few inches away, there's a glaring bit of sloppiness which is totally why the first owner sold it on for so cheap).

I've learned to not see things in terms of linear spectrums. Each thing is different, not better or worse like, kinda like what you're saying. For insurance, Gibson don't really crown their frets like epiphone and everyone else in the world. They round them over, but not to a fine point. The result being a lisp that refuses to die because it's coming from the fretted note itself. Another example is that peerless in Korea also sweated the details nearly as well as Gibson. The mitering of the perfling and binding on my MIK epi sheraton is immaculate as are the intricate inlays.

As for Gibson "nerfing" Epiphone to protect their brand? Yes? I think so to a degree, but you also have to consider the time frame that modern epiphone came around in. The late 90's early 2000's. Back then, it was just impressive to get a set neck guitar with grovers for that kind of money. Keep in mind that MIM fender standards were on a par with these epis and the squiers were significantly worse. Alpha pots were just standard operating procedure back then. And those over wound, over potted humbuckers were exactly what was needed for the emo and dirt bag rock (puddle of mud, creed, etc.) of the day. And I say kudos for epiphone not jacking prices up until they also implemented a bunch of improvements. For context, my sheraton cost $600 from 1999 until 2019.

In a way it's a little gross now because the only thing Gibson have to distinguish themselves from epiphone at this point is country of origin and a some pastoral/inefficient methods. So, the pitch is basically "because luxury." But in another, must more important way, this is awesome! These epiphones are so nice, there truly is no music related reason to upgrade. If you snag a good one, you're set. You're not missing anything beside maybe a Euclidian plane of nitro on a headstock.

[BoringPostcards]

Played one the other day in the same Royal Tan. Loved it. Now I have GAS!

[Larry Mal]

Well, I recommend it. The quality between these two guitars is very close:



So, the ES-330 is appointed nicer in some ways, I guess- not many. The headstock is built better- again, I'm not slamming the Epiphone headstock, which I think is as nice a design, or at least this one I like a lot. But it looks a little more crude.

But to me the finish looks as good, the binding looks as good, it's as well constructed from what I can tell. Also surprising to me, the Riviera has an acoustic sound that rivals the hollow-bodied ES-330.




The playability of the two is the same, at this point I think the 330 needs a little setup actually and seems to be playing a little worse. But the ES-330 is one of the most playable and enjoyable instruments I've ever had, so the Riviera being close or basically the same says a lot to me.

[seenoevil II]

stop making me want things, damnit! Or maybe I should accept that I'll never be sated until I have one of every Gibson thin line double cutaway guitar configuration...jk, but I do wonder what it would sound like with A2 firebird pickups...like a poorer man's es-325...damnit, Larry!

[Larry Mal]

but I do wonder what it would sound like with A2 firebird pickups...like a poorer man's es-325...damnit, Larry!

Well, you know what it would sound like... it would sound good, that's what it would sound like.

But me, I wanted to get this to try out the mini-humbucker thing anyway.

I will say that I've played a few ES-235s and while they are cool, they have that narrow nut width you sometimes see with Norlin guitars.

[seenoevil II]

but I do wonder what it would sound like with A2 firebird pickups...like a poorer man's es-325...damnit, Larry!

Well, you know what it would sound like... it would sound good, that's what it would sound like.

But me, I wanted to get this to try out the mini-humbucker thing anyway.

I will say that I've played a few ES-235s and while they are cool, they have that narrow nut width you sometimes see with Norlin guitars.

uh huh, uh huh, yes, I see, so, you're saying I would need to get one of these rivieras on account of the nut and everything. Yes, interesting, I agree.

But, I stopped by the big boxes today to drop a trumpet in for repair (new years resolution). I got to play one one the new version 335s. Incredibly nice guitar and a distinctly different feel compared to the old dot model. The neck profile was a little interesting, shall we say. Not bad at all whatsoever, but I'd need to get used to it.

Man, imagine starting to play guitar nowadays. So, spoiled.

[Arthon]

I put a deposit in October for the same guitar. It was a really good deal and I didnt want to pass it. Gonna get the guitar at the end of the month, after paying the Christmas bills.

Those Royal Tan Riviera are beautiful. What impressed me the most when I pick it up at the shop was the neck; fuller then a Slim Taper. Slim Taper are ok, but I prefer beefier neck.

Nice to know you have a great experience with your Riviera. I have a Noel Gallagher Riviera already (that is more of a 335 with full sized HB and stop tailbrige) and it's great, so I have no trouble believing you.

[Arthon]

Went to the shop last friday and bring the guitar home. My 2 Rivieras :

[Larry Mal]

There you go- that's a great combination right there. What do you think so far compared to the more ES-335 type model?

[Maggieo]

I was at my local music store and they had a Riviera, in Royal Tan, and I picked it up to play it and mother of god, it was a boat anchor!

It easily outweighed my Greco Les Paul. WTF, Epi?

[Arthon]

There you go- that's a great combination right there. What do you think so far compared to the more ES-335 type model?

The pickup are cleaner and have less output. I like Minis HB. The neck of the normal Rivera is bigger. The Noel Gallagher Riviera have a slim profile with a volute. I only compared them side by side at low volume at home. I will have a better idea when I will bring them at the reahersal room.

Maggio said the Riviera she tested was a boat anchor. Mine is middle weight; the NG Riviera is way more heavy. Probably the heaviest guitar I have. Both have near perfect finish.

My Elistist Casino is missing in the picture. I have a great trio of ES-Style Epiphones.