I'm in love! - Rickenbacker 12 string -

[Soiouz]

A friend of mine just lent me this:



I think it's a 1967 (don't really know how to date these) Rickenbacker model 450/12 string!  I'm in love with this thing! I couldn't stop playing last night, and if I didn't have so much work today, I'd be playing it all day too!!! Great sound, typical Ric with much more possible variations than I thought....


My quest for an electric 12 just might have ended.... He said he might sell it in the coming months as he doesn't use it anymore.


Anyone here has any experience with these as far as reliability, ease of use (I never had a 12, therefore never changed strings on one, nor tuned one...), value??

[serial]

IMHO, Rick 12s are a huge pain to restring.  I've never changed a set w/o bleeding fingers.  If you can live with the neck size, they sound great. That model isn't one of the more costly ones, so even if it was a '67 (I was thinking an early 70s-didn't see much Jetglo in the 60s), it should be affordable.  The 330/335/360/370s (hollowbodies) are the larger ticket Ricks from the 60s, but even they aren't insane yet.  Actually, because of the backlog on new ones that's made the new prices shoot up closer to the real vintage ones.

[mezcalhead]

Ricks aren't about ease of use, they're about sounding great!

A lot of people like the sound but complain about the feel of playing them .. if you like the sound and the way it plays, I'd say you've found yourself a keeper. And as serial says, the solid-body Ricks are less expensive, even the older ones.

[Soiouz]

Yes, I do like the neck size, it plays really well, IMO. If he does sell it to me, I think it will indeed be a keeper!

The only problem I had so far was when I used it standing, as the headstock is too heavy and the guitar is thus unbalanced (I suddenly remembered just how comfortable the offsets are!). And looking at that bridge/tailpiece, I can imagine how a pain in the a** it must be changing strings... Oh well, I guess I could happily suffer for that sound!

[vapourtrail]

rics are about as reliable as it gets imo

changing strings on a ric 12 is no different from changing/tuning the strings on any 12 string really.
double the strings, double the time. have a chromatic tuner handy all the time with any 12 string.

previous 2 posts are right on about the neck size/feel of playing them. it's not as easy to play as most 12 strings.
the 12 string player in my band just got an eastwood 12 for live because he was having problems singing and playing his 360 12 live.
but the sound really can't be beat in my opinion.

[jetset]

It looks to have the hi-gain pickups, not the "toasters" of the '60's.  I'm sure a Rickophile can help you date it.  I think some of the solid body models actually have a slightly wider neck than the 360's etc, that may be one of them.

[Soiouz]

It looks to have the hi-gain pickups, not the "toasters" of the '60's.  I'm sure a Rickophile can help you date it.  I think some of the solid body models actually have a slightly wider neck than the 360's etc, that may be one of them.

I've been surfing on the web trying to date it, and according to what I saw, the bridge is very much 1960's (all the 1970's ones I've seen had a bridge that resembles a TOM), but the pickups, you are right, seem to be the later model... At least the other 1967's I saw had the "toaster" pickups... Also the jack and knob placement are consistent with 1960's too... the 1970's ones I saw had the jack a little closer to the bridge....            I really don't know. 

[serial]

changing strings on a ric 12 is no different from changing/tuning the strings on any 12 string really.
double the strings, double the time. have a chromatic tuner handy all the time with any 12 string.

Actually, changing strings on a Rick IS different.  The way the octave strings sit in the slotted part of the headstock makes it almost impossible to not impale your fingertips on a string end or get backlash scratches and gouges across your hands if they let go.  All other 12s I've owned have two rows of 6 in line tuners with the posts perpendicular to the top, so there's no difference b/w the main and the octave strings.  The bridge end of Rick stringing is no big deal.

If you're comfortable with the way it plays-grab it.  I've always liked that model Rick and have come dangerously close to pulling the trigger a bunch of times-I even think I could get around the neck width issue (I have large hands).  As for neck dive, I discovered the absolute best answer to that this weekend.  Wear a velvet jacket and a woven strap.  Did that friday night and the strap might as well have been velcroed to my jacket!

[cmatthes]

I was a Ric devotee through the late 80s/early 90s.  I'm still a huge fan of their 12 strings, but although I got over the string changing issues (it IS a pain, but you learn tricks over time), the cramped lower fret issues made me finally seek out alternatives.  It's a shame, because nothing sounds like a great Ric 12.  If you like the one you've got your hands on, you will most likely still like it in 5, even 10 years.  They are classics.

If they would only listen to the legions of players looking for a 660 width neck on a 360, they'd be able to double their facility and output!

[Jay]

I've got two Rics, an 80's 610 and 60's 360.  Amazing guitars, especially the 360.  Had a 360 XII and can pretty much echo the sentiment here, PITA to re-string but they sound great.  That one looks fantastic too... though the missing toasters is a bit of a drag.  They're much cooler pickups IMO.

[frippy]

It looks to have the hi-gain pickups, not the "toasters" of the '60's.  I'm sure a Rickophile can help you date it.  I think some of the solid body models actually have a slightly wider neck than the 360's etc, that may be one of them.

The 425 (one pickup) and 450 (two pickup) had the same neck as the 330/340. The 660 has the much wider neck -- comfortable with 12-strings and rather too wide with 6-strings.

FWIW the pickups are probably not original. A good many 450s had their pickups and bridges changed and many, many 425s were converted to 450-ish specs (much like George Harrison's 425). Whether a vintage original or vintage modified those 425s and 450s are superb guitars IMO.

[Soiouz]

It looks to have the hi-gain pickups, not the "toasters" of the '60's.  I'm sure a Rickophile can help you date it.  I think some of the solid body models actually have a slightly wider neck than the 360's etc, that may be one of them.

The 425 (one pickup) and 450 (two pickup) had the same neck as the 330/340. The 660 has the much wider neck -- comfortable with 12-strings and rather too wide with 6-strings.

FWIW the pickups are probably not original. A good many 450s had their pickups and bridges changed and many, many 425s were converted to 450-ish specs (much like George Harrison's 425). Whether a vintage original or vintage modified those 425s and 450s are superb guitars IMO.

Thanks!! That's great info!

[frippy]

Thanks!! That's great info!

You're welcome! They're great guitars! You scored one hella sweet Jetglo 12-string 

[Fall reverb]

FWIW the pickups are probably not original. A good many 450s had their pickups and bridges changed and many, many 425s were converted to 450-ish specs (much like George Harrison's 425). Whether a vintage original or vintage modified those 425s and 450s are superb guitars IMO.

I agree with acoustic frippy that these are great-sounding & playing guitars, however I have no reason to doubt - although more pics would be helpful - that this Rick isn't completely original; the 450-12 was produced between 1964 and 1985, and Rickenbacker's "Hi-gain" pickups were introduced in 1969, and this example seems to be a completely legitimate and unchanged post-1969 450-12;
In my experience quite a few (post-1969) Rickenbackers that originally featured "Hi-gain" pickups were modified by having "toaster" pickups installed (i.e. the older style pickups, which many people associate with the 60's 'jangle sound'), however it's of course possible that this particular guitar is a pre-1969 450-12 which has been equipped with "Hi-gains" by a previous owner...

Soiouz - the serial number of the guitar can normally be found on the bridge-assembly, and if you use Rickenbacker's own serial number 'decoder' which is featured on their website, you'll be able to find out when your Rick was manufactured -
http://www.rickenbacker.com/service_serials.asp

Have fun with your guitar!

[Soiouz]

Wow!! Thanks a lot for that decoder!!  The guitar is not as old as the owner led me to believe. According to that Ric website, it was manufactured in July 1979, hence the second generation pickups..  Too bad for the 1960's aura! It's a great guitar nonetheless!!