Re: jazzmaster japan or usa?

Daysleeper · Post by **Daysleeper** » Tue May 15, 2007 2:30 pm

I agree. For me AVRI's win out. They are not much more money considering you get a Hardshell case and lasting quality.

I have had a CIJ's and MIJ's. Problems with the electronics in all of them. They also did feel like a much less quality build in my hands. I can't explain it but that's how I felt with imports...not that I haven't played some very nice imports, because I have.

The AVRI's are solid to me. I feel like I'm playing something that I never want to put down. No electrical problems at all. The difference to me is astounding! Also I love the stock pickups in the AVRI's...the main reason i bought two of them.

JazzBlaster · Post by **JazzBlaster** » Tue May 15, 2007 2:49 pm

Yeah, I guess when you factor in the case a used AVRI is about $1200 whereas an MIJ/CIJ goes for $700-*800 (net prices) plus the $200 for a hardcase plus $200 for new pickups, switches, shields etc. You really aren't saving yourself mutch.

David

Surfoverb · Post by **Surfoverb** » Tue May 15, 2007 3:14 pm

JazzBlaster wrote: Yeah, I guess when you factor in the case a used AVRI is about $1200 whereas an MIJ/CIJ goes for $700-*800 (net prices) plus the $200 for a hardcase plus $200 for new pickups, switches, shields etc. You really aren't saving yourself mutch.

David

For me to buy a japanese jag it would have cost me about 200$ more than what I paid for my avri(780$). (Of course the Japanese one wouldve been spanking new and the color of my choice, whereas the avri is slightly used and the second color of my choice) You rarely see an avri jag/jazz that doesnt inlcude the hardcase either.

200$ for a case? Thats crazy. I bought a new american standard strat that came with a sweet molded guitar shaped hard case that was only 85$. I loved that case, didnt care for the strat too much, but man that case was sweet.

JazzBlaster · Post by **JazzBlaster** » Tue May 15, 2007 4:56 pm

there are very few cases a Jazzmaster will fit in

Surfoverb · Post by **Surfoverb** » Tue May 15, 2007 5:14 pm

JazzBlaster wrote: there are very few cases a Jazzmaster will fit in

Yeah, that sucks... I guess I just took it for granted that my Jag came with a case.

Pumpkin · Post by **Pumpkin** » Tue May 15, 2007 7:14 pm

What it comes down to is what we all want to play,what we like and sadly for some what image it generates.

I have a 66 mustang and its great,a beautiful guitar that i totaly love but i love my Japanese Jag more.

Vintage = Happy Camper!
AV = Happy Camper!
CIJ = Happy Camper!

Until you play all of these ya really cant say whats best,and even then you still cant say until you've played all of them modified to your standards,try em and buy the one you love!

On a side note, there is absolutely no such thing as "BETTER"in any aspect of existence,its all personal opinion and that is all.

JazzBlaster · Post by **JazzBlaster** » Tue May 15, 2007 8:39 pm

Pumpkin wrote: What it comes down to is what we all want to play,what we like and sadly for some what image it generates.

I have a 66 mustang and its great,a beautiful guitar that i totaly love but i love my Japanese Jag more.

Vintage = Happy Camper!
AV = Happy Camper!
CIJ = Happy Camper!

Until you play all of these ya really cant say whats best,and even then you still cant say until you've played all of them modified to your standards,try em and buy the one you love!

On a side note, there is absolutely no such thing as "BETTER"in any aspect of existence,its all personal opinion and that is all.

+1 I don't think there is a Jazzmaster made I wouldn't own, I have never had the pleasure of playing an AVRI but I would love to. I have owned vintage and Japanese guitars alike. The thing I like about my MIJ JM is that it is not to expensive of a guitar. It has been everywhere that I have been and I have never had to wory about it. It's been 13 years and my MIJ jazzmaster goes everwhere with me still in the same gig bag, slung over my shoulder.

David

starfish · Post by **starfish** » Tue May 15, 2007 9:12 pm

Pumpkin wrote: On a side note, there is absolutely no such thing as "BETTER"in any aspect of existence,its all personal opinion and that is all.

I generally agree with everything you said except this last bit, where I tend to strongly disagree. This is more a personal mantra of mine so forgive my relatively long wind and passioned rebuttal. Please keep in mind I mean no personal attack here. I see this type of statement in threads of all sorts where qualities are being debated. I just disagree with the premise that opinion is an all leveling factor. There is still science too and in the end you can measure physical characteristics in both sound and playability. It reminds me a bit of the trend these days to tell all schoolchildren that there are no winners and losers, no A's and no F's. No one keeping score or improving anywhere. Only a big happy and global family. It is noble for being utopian, but steps away a bit from reality and perhaps physics too.

In the "no betters" standard a Robin Guthrie recording is no "better" than one by Paris Hilton. A Collings is no better than an Esteban. To the contrary, there are achievable, measurable standards and differences in quality in all fields from making music to building musical instruments. Now thankfully we are at the top of the food chain as it were with highly-discriminating tastes for JM's and Jaguars. But differences are still meansureable and usually visible to even the least trained eye, hand and ear.

When it comes to instruments I'll simplify and say the 2 most important qualities are feel and sound. If money were no object and there were a room filled with vintage JM's and all other builds and every one on this forum could play and pick the best to take home, I would highly doubt there would be very many vintage JM's left in the room if any at all. Next to go - AVRI. It's not the mystique, it's not soley personal opinion, it's what feels and sounds best which is directly linked to the physical properties of the instrument. That *is* measureable from neck radius to pickup windings to the sound waves hitting our ears.

Sidenote: Did I mention I feel strongly about this? Anyway, don't take any of this personally. I like a heated debate because from debate emerges knowledge and from knowledge emerges discrimination and so on until the real free market responds to the demands of the players like us who are spending their hard earned money on pretty expensive instruments, at any price point. (See my CS Bass Vi rant. Overall I'm happy but there's always room for measureable improvements.)

JazzBlaster · Post by **JazzBlaster** » Tue May 15, 2007 9:19 pm

a guitar can be just an object... or something you love

spaceghost · Post by **spaceghost** » Tue May 15, 2007 9:48 pm

well said, starfish, well said.

mudhoney · Post by **mudhoney** » Thu May 17, 2007 10:59 am

Surfoverb wrote: Depends where you are too. If you are in Europe your better off buying a Japanese one. But, of course in the US we can get AVRI's for under $1,000 slightly used.

Ive recently read that the Japan exports to the US are of lesser quality than the Japan exports to Europe, not sure about all that though.

Europe, but I have tried the japaneese version and did not like it...it should not be hard to get one AVRI on e-bay...

I have a custom jaguar with jazz neck and P-90s, nitro finish but I would love to have another guitar and I think that maybe AVRI is good enough choice...

also a mustang reisue would be nice

Daysleeper · Post by **Daysleeper** » Thu May 17, 2007 2:21 pm

I agree with Starfish too.

Surfoverb · Post by **Surfoverb** » Thu May 17, 2007 4:10 pm

Daysleeper wrote: I agree with Starfish too.

I dunno, sounds like qualitative utilitarianism to me. whos to say Paris Hilton fans dont enjoy the same happiness listening to her as do Mozart fans?

Im just saying. :-\

spaceghost · Post by **spaceghost** » Thu May 17, 2007 4:13 pm

Surfoverb wrote:
Daysleeper wrote: I agree with Starfish too.
I dunno, sounds like qualitative utilitarianism to me. whos to say Paris Hilton fans dont enjoy the same happiness listening to her as do Mozart fans?

Im just saying. :-\

what's wrong with qualitative utilitarianism?

Paris probably didn't even write any of the music on her album. The motivation is all wrong.
I'm not saying i don't see your point, but still...

Surfoverb · Post by **Surfoverb** » Thu May 17, 2007 4:47 pm

spaceghost wrote:
what's wrong with qualitative utilitarianism?

Paris probably didn't even write any of the music on her album. The motivation is all wrong.
I'm not saying i don't see your point, but still...

I just think its silly to rate happiness on scales. What abpout the person who listens to Mozart AND Paris Hilton? Ive gotten the same amount of happiness from reading 'Crime and Punishment' as I have reading 'How to be a stand-up comic' by Richard Belzar. I can enjoy listening to John coltrane AND Suicidal Tendencies. What about if someone plays a MIJ Jag thier whole life thinking it was an AVRI? Were they enjoying less happiness?

How can happiness NOT be subjective?